[gclions]

I removed the following for my measurements:
-filter housing lid
-rubber flex joint between clean air pipe and filter housing
-clean air pipe
-took HFAMM out of clean air pipe to measure flange
-long air inlet tubing from under hood latch to rubber flex joint
-disconnected the crankcase vent tube

I checked codes yesterday evening and had a CIC code, the same one I get for BMS stage 1. My guess is it flags any time you disconnect one of the many engine management connectors under the hood. In this case, I had unplugged and removed the driver's side HFAMM.

BB, when you had the front off, did you think filters in the front would work? My eyeball says yes, but good measurements would clear up any question. I traced the shape of the inlet pipe, I'm going to measure it to see what we could fit through the holes there in the front. My hope is a 3" outside diameter round pipe will fit, allowing a multitude of options for intake filter selection.

Also, how difficult is accessing the front? I've read some guys just pull hard and the grill covers pop off, where others have done more disassembly to remove them. I haven't done this yet, but it will be a necessity for anything we do with intakes do to space restrictions.

[badblack550xi]

Originally Posted by gclions

I removed the following for my measurements:
-filter housing lid
-rubber flex joint between clean air pipe and filter housing
-clean air pipe
-took HFAMM out of clean air pipe to measure flange
-long air inlet tubing from under hood latch to rubber flex joint
-disconnected the crankcase vent tube

I checked codes yesterday evening and had a CIC code, the same one I get for BMS stage 1. My guess is it flags any time you disconnect one of the many engine management connectors under the hood. In this case, I had unplugged and removed the driver's side HFAMM.

BB, when you had the front off, did you think filters in the front would work? My eyeball says yes, but good measurements would clear up any question. I traced the shape of the inlet pipe, I'm going to measure it to see what we could fit through the holes there in the front. My hope is a 3" outside diameter round pipe will fit, allowing a multitude of options for intake filter selection.

Also, how difficult is accessing the front? I've read some guys just pull hard and the grill covers pop off, where others have done more disassembly to remove them. I haven't done this yet, but it will be a necessity for anything we do with intakes do to space restrictions.

i took the whole front... nut the grilles do pop out if you pull on them with both hands....

[evanswan]

gclions

Were you getting this code with stage 1. 102302:
Hot film air mass meter, operating range: Period duration too low, air mass too high
Terry said to replace the MAF. have you fixed your code issue? just curious. I am getting this code running stage 2

[gclions]

Car is getting a new transmission, should get it back in a day or two. I'll put stage 1 back on it, and check the code. I never thought much of it, but as people keep progressing through tuning options the codes to be expected will be beneficial, so I'll keep a better log of what I find.

As a side note, those HFAMM's (HFM, mass air meter, etc) are pretty expensive, but I did a little reading on how they work, pretty neat stuff. Not like a mass air flow meter like I'm used to, but BMW has used this design in some shape or form for a while now. At first I was worried about HFAMM positioning and diameter of the air intake piping, but the more I read the less concerned I am. I need the car back to check one more thing, then it's time to order materials and start fabrication.

[gclions]

Guys,

Sorry for the slow response, baseline dyno conducted today (the Navy doesn't care about BMWs).

No torque unfortunately, does anyone know where to get RPMs?

The guys at the shop couldn't get a good tap, but will run it again once if I figure out where to get it.

As an aside, they said the car was a monster, and the engine was ridiculous. They had never ran a big BMW, and were blown away by the power these things have. It put down the same numbers as a built, stroked, ported/polished late model GTO (that came there in a trailer). Of course the GTO had a 400 hp shot of nitrous.

Here's my dyno run from earlier, it was a Dynojet 224.





Hope to get pieces fabricated soon for HFAMM, tubing is in route. Powder coating is lined up. Filters are being shipped. Excited to see if this thing works.

- Grant

[combatbmw]

Damn sae and 418! Must have more mods.?

[gclions]

Nope, just BMS stage 1. I removed the carbon filters, but who knows if it actually made a difference. It does have a brand new transmission, thanks to the fine folks at BMW, who apparently would just assume replace the 8 speed auto versus repair it.

Still needs four new injectors, so I'm going to try and speed up the process a little.

Here is some additional info:

90F outside at time of dyno
4th gear pull
93 octane, Shell V-Power

[combatbmw]

Originally Posted by gclions

Nope, just BMS stage 1. I removed the carbon filters, but who knows if it actually made a difference. It does have a brand new transmission, thanks to the fine folks at BMW, who apparently would just assume replace the 8 speed auto versus repair it.

Still needs four new injectors, so I'm going to try and speed up the process a little.

Here is some additional info:

90F outside at time of dyno
4th gear pull
93 octane, Shell V-Power

Just Bms stage 1?
Thats a big power gain, but your SAE everyone is posting STD numbers which means your like 20hp or so higher if the sheet was read in STD.

Im sure someone can help you with your other questions.

[ARC550]

Numbers are low... Something up... Broski I think you got a lemon. Or your BMS is not working. Those numbers look Like a stock dyno.

[combatbmw]

Originally Posted by ARC550

Numbers are low... Something up... Broski I think you got a lemon. Or your BMS is not working. Those numbers look Like a stock dyno.

It's sae. So it's reading low and it's a stage 1 for n63

[gclions]

Originally Posted by combatbmw

It's sae. So it's reading low and it's a stage 1 for n63

Yeah, the SAE correction is little lower than STD. From what I can find, it seems about 2.6% lower. So, that would end up around 429.70 rwhp using that factor, which is not a lemon, it's actually a little higher than what I expected.

The curve on the BMS site uses STD and stage 1 produced a peak of 425.80 rwhp.

Regardless, we are just scratching the surface on these engines. My hope is that someone cracks the ECU eventually leading to large gains in power, but in the mean time we can inch closer to 500 rwhp with available mods (and a few in the works).

[combatbmw]

Originally Posted by gclions

Yeah, the SAE correction is little lower than STD. From what I can find, it seems about 2.6% lower. So, that would end up around 429.70 rwhp using that factor, which is not a lemon, it's actually a little higher than what I expected.

The curve on the BMS site uses STD and stage 1 produced a peak of 425.80 rwhp.

Regardless, we are just scratching the surface on these engines. My hope is that someone cracks the ECU eventually leading to large gains in power, but in the mean time we can inch closer to 500 rwhp with available mods (and a few in the works).

Agree your good man. Arch just has trouble reading posts.

[gclions]

So 3.00" aluminum tubing and filters will be here in a few days. I took the air filter box lid and the HFAMM to a local machine shop just now for measurements. The guy there was pretty awesome, though he couldn't understand why I would want to make an intake. I explained the lack of a market, so the community will need to do it on their own. He still looked puzzled, but he took measurements to my satisfaction.

Goals over the next two weeks will be to reperform my base dyno run with BMS stage 1, finish fabrication of one pair of intakes, and follow up with a dyno run with the intakes on the car.

Assuming the intakes work well enough for people to be interested in me making more, will anyone interested be concerned if I run dynos with BMS stage 1 installed? I can get stock numbers, but it will cost me $110 in dyno fees. Not a problem really, but I don't want to do it if it doesn't matter in the end. The local shop I'm using for dynos is always backed up, so I need to plan ahead for any appointments.

Last thing, would anyone be interested in just the intake tubes and no filters? I'm planning on sticking with a larger brand (I ordered aFe to start), but I would imagine some people have a preference. As such, they might prefer to buy the filters they want (color, shape, etc). Just curious of your guys thoughts.

[badblack550xi]

Originally Posted by gclions

So 3.00" aluminum tubing and filters will be here in a few days. I took the air filter box lid and the HFAMM to a local machine shop just now for measurements. The guy there was pretty awesome, though he couldn't understand why I would want to make an intake. I explained the lack of a market, so the community will need to do it on their own. He still looked puzzled, but he took measurements to my satisfaction.

Goals over the next two weeks will be to reperform my base dyno run with BMS stage 1, finish fabrication of one pair of intakes, and follow up with a dyno run with the intakes on the car.

Assuming the intakes work well enough for people to be interested in me making more, will anyone interested be concerned if I run dynos with BMS stage 1 installed? I can get stock numbers, but it will cost me $110 in dyno fees. Not a problem really, but I don't want to do it if it doesn't matter in the end. The local shop I'm using for dynos is always backed up, so I need to plan ahead for any appointments.

Last thing, would anyone be interested in just the intake tubes and no filters? I'm planning on sticking with a larger brand (I ordered aFe to start), but I would imagine some people have a preference. As such, they might prefer to buy the filters they want (color, shape, etc). Just curious of your guys thoughts.

Main concern here is how will the intake reduce ambient heat that comes from the engine? that reaches well over 200F i think it best would be to have the tubing covered in ceramic coating inside and out.... to keep the temps down inside intake.

[gclions]

I have powder coating lined up, and the guy can do ceramics as well. I have a quote for powder coating the outside only, not sure of the cost to ceramic inside and out. I can ask to see if it's going to cause a significant change in cost.

I have scoops for the front mocked up, just need to get them punched out of sheetmetal. It was a pain in the butt, but I removed the row of plastic fins directly behind the grills to give me room to install them. The ones I have won't take up much room, and will be right next to the intakes behind the grills.

My hope is a little redirected air flow can help keep it cool. Who knows if it will work, but it's worth a shot. It's expensive to get the machine work done, so hopefully it works.

Badblack, off topic, but any thoughts on running drag radials?

[badblack550xi]

Originally Posted by gclions

I have powder coating lined up, and the guy can do ceramics as well. I have a quote for powder coating the outside only, not sure of the cost to ceramic inside and out. I can ask to see if it's going to cause a significant change in cost.

I have scoops for the front mocked up, just need to get them punched out of sheetmetal. It was a pain in the butt, but I removed the row of plastic fins directly behind the grills to give me room to install them. The ones I have won't take up much room, and will be right next to the intakes behind the grills.

My hope is a little redirected air flow can help keep it cool. Who knows if it will work, but it's worth a shot. It's expensive to get the machine work done, so hopefully it works.

Badblack, off topic, but any thoughts on running drag radials?

will be Running on Hankook RS-3

[gclions]

Are you going Hankooks on all four corners or just the rears? I'm running low on tread on the rears for some unknown reason...very strange it's just the rears.

Jokes aside, I was thinking of picking up another pair of factory wheels and putting some drag radials on for trips to the track. Just swap them out when I get there. I suppose some are made to drive on, but I'm guessing even the best would be trouble if had a light rain on the way to the track.

Those R-S3's are rated pretty well, I'm guessing you can get solidly into the 11's with those, possibly 11.82 or so? Your launch is pretty great already, at least your 60 foot time is great, I wonder what kind of improvement you could get at launch with some sticky tires on the back?

Good luck, looking forward to seeing more time slips posted.

[berkel]

Originally Posted by gclions

Regardless, we are just scratching the surface on these engines. My hope is that someone cracks the ECU eventually leading to large gains in power, but in the mean time we can inch closer to 500 rwhp with available mods (and a few in the works).

My friend's brother got an Audi S5, which made me research what the S6 guys are doing now (I was looking for an S6 last year when I bought my 550ix).

Damn, those guys are in the 11s with just the flash. I saw that an S8 with a similar engine as the S6, but 8sp tranny like our 550ix was running in the 10s with 100 octane and a flash?! Is it just having the ECU cracked that's letting them get such better results?

Anyway, kudos to the guys trying to get more perf out of our F10s, hopefully there will be more options and better results in the future.

[ARC550]

Originally Posted by combatbmw

Agree your good man. Arch just has trouble reading posts.

It's still low!

I have a stage 1 n63TU and I dynoed on a dyno jet 481/541 and my dial was set to standard setting A.K.A stage 1.

So even if you did dyno 430 that's low! You should be at 450ish minimum with 480trq lol I mean look at Terry's numbers! Unless he somehow ballooned them lol

[gclions]

Berkel,

The flash tune guys have a serious advantage currently, and until someone cracks the newer BMW ECU's, we're stuck in neutral effectively. The community is going to be limited by piggybacks, exhausts, and intakes. I mean, we're so thirsty for more power that air scoops (which provide little benefit) and snapping the carbon silencers out of our airboxes in hopes of squeezing out another pony or two are options for most of us. I had an APR tuned GTI that ran 18 psi, and there was nothing easier to work on, just change a few mechanical parts (diverter valve, blowoff valve, etc) and you're really getting a jump in HP.

Arc,

My car is a 2011 N63, while I understand what you're saying, I don't quite think we're talking apples to apples. Here's the graph from the BMS website, it's in STD, and if you look at the stage 1 numbers, my previous post was spot on:



So your thinking sounds correct, but stage 1 N63TU using the stock map/settings clearly isn't the same if you got those numbers on the dyno. Did you do your pull in 4th gear? On an accidental shift to 5th gear my dyno numbers were around 447.00 rwhp, but I threw that data out as it's not a 1:1 gear ratio and the shift tricked the dyno computer into showing more rwhp that wasn't really there. Here is the N63TU dyno graph from BMS, and the "stock" N63TU was actually 385.24 rwhp:



I think the numbers I got were to be expected, but it all won't matter much, as I hope to pick up stage 2 sooner rather than later.

[ARC550]

I understand your reasoning ? I dynoed in 4th gear with DSC full deactivated . That is the only way you can dyno our cars. My car was dynoed over 15 times and it was always consistent with a -/+5 diffrence in each run.
Also our cars tend to loose power after 6K RPM which sucks.

I was at the track and when I let the car shift I was tuning 12.3 at 114MPH
When I did manual shift at 6.2KRPM I went down to 12.0 @ 116MPH..

Also, you are absolutely spot on. We need a real tune fir the engine and we need a real tune for the transmission... Cough cough a real LC feature not a 3KRPM break torque. We need a 4.5K launch!

Originally Posted by gclions

Berkel,

The flash tune guys have a serious advantage currently, and until someone cracks the newer BMW ECU's, we're stuck in neutral effectively. The community is going to be limited by piggybacks, exhausts, and intakes. I mean, we're so thirsty for more power that air scoops (which provide little benefit) and snapping the carbon silencers out of our airboxes in hopes of squeezing out another pony or two are options for most of us. I had an APR tuned GTI that ran 18 psi, and there was nothing easier to work on, just change a few mechanical parts (diverter valve, blowoff valve, etc) and you're really getting a jump in HP.

Arc,

My car is a 2011 N63, while I understand what you're saying, I don't quite think we're talking apples to apples. Here's the graph from the BMS website, it's in STD, and if you look at the stage 1 numbers, my previous post was spot on:



So your thinking sounds correct, but stage 1 N63TU using the stock map/settings clearly isn't the same if you got those numbers on the dyno. Did you do your pull in 4th gear? On an accidental shift to 5th gear my dyno numbers were around 447.00 rwhp, but I threw that data out as it's not a 1:1 gear ratio and the shift tricked the dyno computer into showing more rwhp that wasn't really there. Here is the N63TU dyno graph from BMS, and the "stock" N63TU was actually 385.24 rwhp:



I think the numbers I got were to be expected, but it all won't matter much, as I hope to pick up stage 2 sooner rather than later.

[badblack550xi]

Originally Posted by gclions

Are you going Hankooks on all four corners or just the rears? I'm running low on tread on the rears for some unknown reason...very strange it's just the rears.

Jokes aside, I was thinking of picking up another pair of factory wheels and putting some drag radials on for trips to the track. Just swap them out when I get there. I suppose some are made to drive on, but I'm guessing even the best would be trouble if had a light rain on the way to the track.

Those R-S3's are rated pretty well, I'm guessing you can get solidly into the 11's with those, possibly 11.82 or so? Your launch is pretty great already, at least your 60 foot time is great, I wonder what kind of improvement you could get at launch with some sticky tires on the back?

Good luck, looking forward to seeing more time slips posted.

I will be running hankooks on all 4 corners... Don't waste money on stock wheels.. If you're going to get track only set get 18 inch ASA with slicks or drag radials. I got the 19 inch for summer time they are 23 lbs vs 33lbs stock wheels... 18 inch are 18 lbs I think my 60 foot will be 1.5 with all rs3 and lighter wheels and maybe 120 trap.