[E60525d]

On the M sport package, what exactly does the M sports suspension consist of? Is it just different springs with a slightly lower ride height?

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by E60525d

On the M sport package, what exactly does the M sports suspension consist of? Is it just different springs with a slightly lower ride height?

Springs, dampers and anti roll bars. Not sure if any of the bushings are different and whether the steering is more weighted, (without the high tech add ons).

Someone else may have the exact technical spec/data.

HighlandPete

[bobblehead]

Commented by Carl_d (UK) ... from another thread...

M-Sport suspension is tuned by M and includes lowered springs (10mm) tuned dampers and better bushing. Its is not just lowered springs!

[kjando]

I am confused. There were several posts suggesting that the M-sport package available in the US consisted only of cosmetic additions, i.e. the aero kit and interior changes. In addition, there was a post that stated that the m-sport package that changes the springs and other suspension changes was only available in Europe at this time. However, in reading the new US brochure on the 5 series, under the M Sport Package description, one sentence reads "The M sport transmission is tuned to take demanding driving manuevers to the next level". This implies that there is indeed some suspension changes that are part of the M-sport package in the US and not just cosmetic changes as a few have implied.

[bimmernic]

Lower springs, retuned dampers, thicker anti-roll/sway bars. The parts department at the country distributor has also confirmed that the bushings are harder (stiffer) than that used in the normal suspension.

In addition, with Option 2TB (sport automatic transmission), where you have the Normal/Sport/Sport+ options on the toggle button next to the gear shift, the suspension appears to firm up when "Sport" mode is selected. On my car, it does get bumpier in "Sport" mode. Placebo effect, perhaps , but noticeably so, even if the same parts department also indicates that the M-Sport suspension does not employ adaptive dampers - go figure. Other owners with Option 704 (M-sport suspension) also report the same experience.

See quote and thread below (where Robin Hood refers to the experience of another Dutch owner).

Originally Posted by Robin Hood

My car gets 2 clicks stiffer at Sport/+...noticable...

Sport+ the stabilitycontrol isn't 100% turned off:It just allows you to 'drift' a certain angle and beyond that the Stabilitycontrol kicks in(been there done that). If you push the small button above the Normal/Sport/+ button for a second or three, there is no tractioncontrol at all, allows you to make some rather nice drifts(in the rain it's just easier, gears are rather short, but anyway it will drift)

http://f10.5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=403008

With the M-Sport suspension, the steering (in "Normal" mode) is also better, with more weight and feel and less "deadness" around the centre position when compared to an F10 with the standard suspension and transmission. However, I am unable to say if this is due to the sports automatic transmission or the M-sport suspension.

[Titanflux]

Yeah, it's a whole different setup. Having had a variety of M Sport suspensions in the UK, I have now decided that if I ever get another M Sport model I will delete the M sport suspension - BMW now offer this on most models in the UK because it might be great on German roads which are brilliant, but not in the UK.

It is just too harsh for our rubbish UK roads, which following 2 years of bad weather are getting much worse, and with the spending reivew road repair cutbacks will get even worse over the months and years to come. I have become tired of wincing ever time I see a lummp, bump or small pothole which I can't avoid! Even cats eyes can be uncomfortable with M sport suspension with RFTs.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by bimmernic

Lower springs, retuned dampers, thicker anti-roll/sway bars. The parts department at the country distributor has also confirmed that the bushings are harder (stiffer) than that used in the normal suspension.

In addition, with Option 2TB (sport automatic transmission), where you have the Normal/Sport/Sport+ options on the toggle button next to the gear shift, the suspension appears to firm up when "Sport" mode is selected. On my car, it does get bumpier in "Sport" mode. Placebo effect, perhaps , but noticeably so, even if the same parts department also indicates that the M-Sport suspension does not employ adaptive dampers - go figure. Other owners with Option 704 (M-sport suspension) also report the same experience.

See quote and thread below (where Robin Hood refers to the experience of another Dutch owner).



http://f10.5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=403008

With the M-Sport suspension, the steering (in "Normal" mode) is also better, with more weight and feel and less "deadness" around the centre position when compared to an F10 with the standard suspension and transmission. However, I am unable to say if this is due to the sports automatic transmission or the M-sport suspension.

There are no 'active' parts in the suspension of the 'passive' M-sport system. The sport setting, with the sport auto gearbox, set to sport/sport+ gives a steering weighting change. Been discussed before and confirmed by BMW to not have active parts. Yes it definitely feels more than a steering change, experienced this myself, (on a standard supension setup) but there are no active suspension parts.

The US market get Adaptive Drive as part of the sport package, the active system. They don't get the passive M-sport suspension option, like we do in Europe/UK. We of course can specify Adaptive Drive in the M-sport cars and get the adjustable suspension.

HighlandPete

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by kjando

I am confused. There were several posts suggesting that the M-sport package available in the US consisted only of cosmetic additions, i.e. the aero kit and interior changes. In addition, there was a post that stated that the m-sport package that changes the springs and other suspension changes was only available in Europe at this time. However, in reading the new US brochure on the 5 series, under the M Sport Package description, one sentence reads "The M sport transmission is tuned to take demanding driving manuevers to the next level". This implies that there is indeed some suspension changes that are part of the M-sport package in the US and not just cosmetic changes as a few have implied.

I assume you are talking of the ZMP (M Sport Package) package, if so you have 2VA (223 & 229) in the spec'. That is the 'active' Adaptive Drive suspension system with the adjustable settings, including sport and sport+.

As said in the last post, you don't have the passive M-sport suspension option.

HighlandPete

[Jon D]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Springs, dampers and anti roll bars. Not sure if any of the bushings are different and whether the steering is more weighted, (without the high tech add ons).

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

There are no 'active' parts in the suspension of the 'passive' M-sport system. The sport setting, with the sport auto gearbox, set to sport/sport+ gives a steering weighting change. Been discussed before and confirmed by BMW to not have active parts. Yes it definitely feels more than a steering change, experienced this myself, (on a standard supension setup) but there are no active suspension parts.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but we never seem to learn from it and I now wish I'd made the effort to find a dealer with a base M Sport F10. However, I was in a hurry to beat the UK January VAT (sales tax) increase, so on the strength of a couple of test drives in a 530d SE without Adaptive Drive/Variable Damper Control, I ordered my 535d MS with the option even though I hadn't tried it.
As discussed at considerable length in the 'How does your steering feel' thread, there is an issue and I'm now wondering if all the gadgetry combined with EPS results in the somewhat detached feel and lack of steering feedback.
I'm eagerly awaiting the new 6 coupé, but in the hope that I've learned a lesson in driving exactly what you want before ordering, I shall take considerably more time in the choosing.

[northernmonkey]

Interesting....Jon D so you have the M-Sport suspension with adaptive drive and VDC? or are you saying you have the M-Sport model but with the standard suspension plus the AD/VDC added to it?

This is my 3rd BMW in a row of the UK M-Sport variety and this F11 has by far the best (for that read comfortable....which is good or bad depending on your point of view) suspension and ride setup of any of my other M-Sport cars (E60 M-Sport, E92 M-Sport).

The F11 rides well over pretty much all surfaces but does still feel precise and composed without being rock hard like the E92 or E60 were...don't get me wrong I loved those cars but the setup in them wouldn't suit the F11 I don't think. For me the setup feels just right.

[Jon D]

Originally Posted by northernmonkey

Interesting....Jon D so you have the M-Sport suspension with adaptive drive and VDC? or are you saying you have the M-Sport model but with the standard suspension plus the AD/VDC added to it?

This is my 3rd BMW in a row of the UK M-Sport variety and this F11 has by far the best (for that read comfortable....which is good or bad depending on your point of view) suspension and ride setup of any of my other M-Sport cars (E60 M-Sport, E92 M-Sport).

The F11 rides well over pretty much all surfaces but does still feel precise and composed without being rock hard like the E92 or E60 were...don't get me wrong I loved those cars but the setup in them wouldn't suit the F11 I don't think. For me the setup feels just right.

I have the M Sport, but pretty much all you get is the cosmetics of the front and rear bumpers as the car reverts to SE suspension if you opt for the AD/VDC package.
I don't think I'll bother with it if I go for the 6 coupé as, even in sport mode, it's not really firm enough for my liking.
As I said before, I should have driven a base M Sport model before placing my order, but that of course, is only with the benefit of hindsight!

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by northernmonkey

Interesting....Jon D so you have the M-Sport suspension with adaptive drive and VDC? or are you saying you have the M-Sport model but with the standard suspension plus the AD/VDC added to it?

We have the option of the passive M-sport suspension, or Adaptive Drive on the M-sport cars. In the US they have Adaptive Drive only, on their M-sport package.

HighlandPete

[Sharbotcom]

In Canada we have the choice to add Adaptive drive with M-Sport.
Bill

[E60525d]

Originally Posted by Titanflux

Yeah, it's a whole different setup. Having had a variety of M Sport suspensions in the UK, I have now decided that if I ever get another M Sport model I will delete the M sport suspension - BMW now offer this on most models in the UK because it might be great on German roads which are brilliant, but not in the UK.

It is just too harsh for our rubbish UK roads, which following 2 years of bad weather are getting much worse, and with the spending reivew road repair cutbacks will get even worse over the months and years to come. I have become tired of wincing ever time I see a lummp, bump or small pothole which I can't avoid! Even cats eyes can be uncomfortable with M sport suspension with RFTs.

I agree here, im thinking of deleting the M sport suspension.

[indus]

Originally Posted by E60525d

I agree here, im thinking of deleting the M sport suspension.

I think the new M Sport is different. Compared to my E60 M5 the F10 Msport feels like a limosine!

[mcquill]

I left the M Sport suspension on mine, no AD/VDC. I'm very pleased with the ride comfort, much smoother than the E60 and better handling than the non M Sport demo I had.

[bm323]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Springs, dampers and anti roll bars.

Originally Posted by bimmernic

Lower springs, retuned dampers, thicker anti-roll/sway bars.

hi, are there anti-roll bars in the base car? The anti-roll bars are thicker in the M-sport suspension car?

[hockeyfan11]

Hi Guys....in the process of placing an order in Canada

Therefore after reading all the posts...........Is the " dynamic handling package " which includes.... adaptice drive ,dynamic damper and dynamic drive ( sport and sport + inc in the above) worth the $3900.00....

Does the suspension feel that much different when changing modes

[bm323]

Originally Posted by hockeyfan11

Hi Guys....in the process of placing an order in Canada

Therefore after reading all the posts...........Is the " dynamic handling package " which includes.... adaptice drive ,dynamic damper and dynamic drive ( sport and sport + inc in the above) worth the $3900.00....

Does the suspension feel that much different when changing modes

As you are probably aware, but this can't be overemphasize, you really got to test drive the car with and without adaptive drive. It is subjective to the individual, and the condition of the roads yo travel on affects the feel much. The active anti-roll bars are definitely superb but unfortunately, can't be ordered without the full package.

[hockeyfan11]

tks for the input

[bm323]

ps it appears that most forummers who have the adaptive drive are satisfied with it. There may be a handful (myself included ) who are not certain whether the static M-sport suspension is "better" than the one with adaptive drive. If I'm correct, very few have tested the static M-sport suspension and adaptive drive back to back. Pls let us know if there are more views on this. There have been conflicting views as regards whether the static M-sport feels tighter and is more "planted" than the adaptive one in sport mode.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by bm323

... There may be a handful (myself included ) who are not certain whether the static M-sport suspension is "better" than the one with adaptive drive. If I'm correct, very few have tested the static M-sport suspension and adaptive drive back to back. Pls let us know if there are more views on this. There have been conflicting views as regards whether the static M-sport feels tighter and is more "planted" than the adaptive one in sport mode.

Valid point about back to back, but even in 'sport' setting with Adaptive Drive they will be different, not a question of 'better', IMO. The whole set of dynamics are approached from a different design concept, as we have discussed before. A fixed, but passive system, will be totally predictable, once you know it. But an active system, which is continually adjusting (not just a toggle setting change) will feel different, the whole setup is designed to be as soft as possible, until the forces demand a stiffer setting. But with manual 'base' settings.

I do think it is a personal thing, some will never like an active system. Some love a fixed response suspension, even if it does mean compromising the quality of the ride over poor roads.

The same applies to the standard suspension, Adaptive Drive has a different feel to it. I like it, as I want the softer feel, until I start loading up the forces, and then love the way the active system responds.

Certainly agree a test drive is necessary, to gauge which suspension system you prefer.

HighlandPete