[Pottsy]

I am struggling to get a good seating position - I feel all twisted.

There's much talk of the pros and cons of different seats, but I think I have found the reason for the issue, and different seats won't help.

The camera lens was right in the centre of the back of the seat, and the ruler was in the centre of the front of the seat (as best I could).

I suspected the steering wheel to be off-axis, but it isn't. It's just the fact that your feet and legs are bent off to the right. This makes your shoulders off to the left (with your left shoulder forward) which makes the steering wheel feel like it's in the wrong place.

All a bit depressing really!

[HighlandPete]

I'm really surprised you can't get comfortable when the seat and wheel are well aligned. My legs have flexible joints, work well for me.

I've never ever thought my F11 M-sport seat and the positioning to the pedals as uncomfortable, even driving 500 miles in a day. I set up the seat the day I bought the car, (before driving off the forecourt), set its position in memory. Other than a very small tweak to the steering wheel the next day, just to get the instrument display in total vision, its been the same for over 2-years.

Have you back problems?

HighlandPete

[Pottsy]

Nope, no back problems! My issue is that the top of my torso is pushed left, because my legs are off to the right. All because the pedals are in the wrong place - but not much we can do because it's the transmission tunnel at fault.

The XF had no such issue (absolutely perfectly aligned pedals, steering wheel and seat), nor did my Merc previous to that.

It seems to be an old problem in certain cars:

http://e89.zpost.com/forums/showpost...2&postcount=13

http://forum.bmw5.co.uk/topic/88082-...ving-position/

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...ving-Your-Feet

[325_bucks]

have to say pedals feel perfectly positioned to me, never felt they should be more to the left. No place for the clutch pedal for manuals otherwise!

[dippo]

I don't like to ask, but are you what could be called 'vertically challenged'?

[Pottsy]

5' 11".

I'm getting the feeling that the "twisted body" issue doesn't worry many of you. Was out and about in the Disco4 today - seating bliss!

[The Beast]

I found it a little difficult getting comfortable when I went from E70 to F10, but my issue was with my back rather than the pedals. I found the seat had a lot more padding around the lower back area, had to go for a more vertical seating position and this sorted the issue.

Sounds like you are angling your body towards the pedals whereas what I do is sit straight ahead, tilt seat back as far as it will go, keep the back slightly more upright than i normally would, pull out sport seat bolster until it is near the knee joint and place both legs against the side bolsters on the base. I find this works for me...

[Piers]

How bizarre. I find it incredibly comfortable even in a 300 mile day, always fresh, no back pain at all, and I do suffer from back trouble at times.

[wicked5]

Just think, the 3 series (I BELIEVE) does not even have a foot rest, so for a gentleman it is far much more comfortable to have this setup than anything else. The more space the better, particulary for a 300+ mile trip! But I get your point, I first heard about offset steering wheels on an carbuyer review for a C-CLASS merc, I noticed it in other cars I have driven too, I think a lot of it is in the mind. Unless you have not heard about this and genuinely it hurts you to drive, I would believe it's psychological TBH.

[xenon]

The 3 series does have a foot rest - why wouldn't it?

[Pottsy]

Well, it hurts for me - but at the moment I am mitigating it by folding my left leg back on itself at the knee - to allow my thighs to point in the right direction and not introduce a twist on my pelvis/torso. I can tell when things are going wrong, because the HUD starts to blur. My legs go off to the right, my pelvis and lower torso remain well anchored by the seat, but twisted to the right, causing my shoulders to move to the left and pop out of the seat bolsters (slightly). My head is then slightly to the left, missing the sweet spot for the HUD.

This may be worse for me because I drive 80 miles to work, then drive at work for 10 to 13 hours (no break) and then drive home again. The work vehicle is correctly designed though with perfect pedal symmetry and 4 foot rests! But the "legs off to the right / head off to the left" is not imaginary nor psychological, sadly.

And the 3 series has had a foot rest for as long back as I can remember.

[xenon]

What's your work vehicle?

[Pottsy]

Airbus. So no offset in the steering wheel, that's for sure!

[xenon]

Cool. A3xx or a big one?

[Pottsy]

A320. No desire for long haul; increased boredom and time away from home, less challenging airports. Some want that, others don't (and they all fly the same and you earn the same). How OT are we now?!

[xenon]

Pretty much but more interesting than most!

My wife got me a full day 737NG simulator experience for my birthday, being an aviation enthusiast. Loved it

[Pottsy]

Time to whip out the fisheye....

Here are some shots showing the issue, the issue fixed by either folding my left leg or placing my right food under the brake pedal (not great safety wise!), and a shot of the D4 with well placed pedals. Tell me this is psychological!

Problem in BMW - left foot on rest, right foot on accelerator:




Left leg folded at the knee:




Right foot under the brake pedal:




Disco 4:

[AP]

Originally Posted by Pottsy

A320. No desire for long haul; increased boredom and time away from home, less challenging airports. Some want that, others don't (and they all fly the same and you earn the same). How OT are we now?!

how do you find the side stick as opposed to a yoke. (Conscious I don't want to start one of those dreaded Boeing versus Airbus threads....)

Only fly a PA28 Dakota myself so rather jealous!

[Pottsy]

I have been on the Airbus for 10 years now, and the 737 for many years before that (and other aircraft before that). The Airbus FBW is miles better than conventional, and I'd really hate to go back. In not just the sidestick, it's all the other stuff that makes up the flight control system - envelope protections, g control, flight path vector control and so on. If the Airbus is like driving a Disco 4, then the 737 is like a 1950's series 2 Land Rover.

If you want to be a "real man", the 737 will allow you to demonstrate your "skills". If you want to transport hundreds of people around safely on long multi-sector days, Airbus is a clear winner.

[AP]

Originally Posted by Pottsy

I have been on the Airbus for 10 years now, and the 737 for many years before that (and other aircraft before that). The Airbus FBW is miles better than conventional, and I'd really hate to go back. In not just the sidestick, it's all the other stuff that makes up the flight control system - envelope protections, g control, flight path vector control and so on. If the Airbus is like driving a Disco 4, then the 737 is like a 1950's series 2 Land Rover.

If you want to be a "real man", the 737 will allow you to demonstrate your "skills". If you want to transport hundreds of people around safely on long multi-sector days, Airbus is a clear winner.

Interesting, I'll have to sort out some time on a simulator at some point and see what these (airbuses) are like. (had some hours on 747 and 777 simulators way back for a bit of fun.)

[HighlandPete]

Been out in my F11 this morning, being very critical about how I sit and whether I'm just ignoring poor pedal positions.

I don't have any issues at all, the only time I feel something is wrong is if I don't lay my foot on the full length of the accelerator pedal. But I don't drive that way. When both feet are on the full length pedal/rest positions, no body twisting or anything which means my shoulders are involved. Not even when changing from throttle to brake, still doesn't move the back and definitely not the shoulders.

I wonder if some of this issue is how we sit. I'm 5' 9" pretty average proportions and sit biased towards a higher seating position. I set up the position with the wrists over the wheel recommendation, with the wheel to see all the display, which incidentally includes the auto wiper LED, when driving straight.

Whether the seating position makes a difference to others, can't say, but certainly makes the driving position and comfort levels suitable for 500 mile trips with just the necessary pit stops.

HighlandPete

[AP]

I must admit I found it difficult getting my seating position right and did for a short while have a bit of back pain not long after sitting in the car.(I don't normally have any back pain). I found that the answer was to have the seat back in a more vertical position. The seat base I have as high as I can as I prefer that, don't like to feel that I'm sitting on the floor and like to see all 4 corners of the car as best as I can. I put the seat base front down as well quite a bit rather than in a higher position. I sit what some might consider closer to the wheel than perhaps most but it feels comfortable and relaxed.
I have the head restraint also adjusted so it is higher than "out of the box" and is only a couple of cms away from the back of my head.
As I sit fairly close I can put plenty of pressure on the brake pedal should it ever be required.
I'm 5'10" so pretty average I guess.

That works for me and having full electric seats at least means that I have the position in memory should it ever be moved when its being serviced etc.