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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 Warm up or drive off? BMW DOCTOR |
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12-16-2021, 09:58 AM | #1 |
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Warm up or drive off? BMW DOCTOR
My whole life I have always been taught and practiced to turn your car on allow it to warm up before driving off. Especially in cold temperatures.
But I've heard others say that's complete bs and today I watched a YouTube video with this guy called the BMW Doctor lol I know. He claims that turning your car on leaving it to idle to warm up will destroy your seals and gaskets because the oil does not properly circulate while idling. Can someone please clear this up and tell me I'm not destroying my n63 valve stem seals by warming my car up in the morning when it's 20 degrees outside.
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12-16-2021, 10:14 AM | #2 |
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On a warm day, I start and drive immediately. On a really cold day, I sit for 20-30 seconds and then drive. I drive slow for about a mile then normal driving. Been doing that for almost 300K on my 535 and no problem
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12-16-2021, 10:21 AM | #3 |
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I usually wait until revs settle then go some days when it's really cold I may start let it sit for a minute or so then go. But is it true that at idle oil is not fully circulating possibly causing damage to seals and gaskets.
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12-16-2021, 10:25 AM | #4 |
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This is covered in your owners manual...here's some examples from various BMW owners manuals (e38/e53/f06):
As the others have mentioned...in cold weather & the engine RPMs are high, I wait the 15-30 seconds or so for the revs to go back down, then drive off. Usually takes about the time to buckle up and turn on the heated seats and steering wheel and select if I'm going to listen to the radio or connect to something from my phone.
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12-16-2021, 10:32 AM | #5 |
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Wow good information. I don't have an owners manual but I'm gonna download it now. Thanks
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12-16-2021, 11:50 AM | #6 | |
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And just for general knowledge or future reference...if you have the Voice Command/TALK button on the right side button pad on your steering wheel...you don't even have to delve down into iDrive to find the manual...you can simply tell your BMW to pull it up by saying "OWNERS MANUAL" after you hear the tone after pressing the button. Depending on which steering wheel you have the Voice Command/Talk button is shown in the 2 pics below:
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12-16-2021, 12:02 PM | #7 |
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N63TU here I let the RPM’s settle under 1k before driving very time, in cold conditions I drive very conservative until the oil temp comes to at least 180 degrees F before I give it a lot of throttle
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12-16-2021, 12:23 PM | #8 |
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As said, owners manuals over decades have covered it. Don't idle, start driving.
"COLD" varies from person to person. I chuckle every time I read in a car forum about someone in the south idling their car for 5 minutes because it plunged down to 50F the night before. Idling to warm up 1/ keeps the engine running "cold" for longer - more wear 2/ keeps the engine running "warm up program" for longer - more fuel dilution in the oil 3/ doesn't warm up anything else in the driveline, unless there is a heat exchanger with the transmission fluid. As soon as you drive off everything else is still stone cold 4/ wastes time, fuel, adds carbon foot print etc... 5/ doesn't work. I have never had a aluminum engine that actually warmed up idling in the *winter*. It can take the chill off but never reaches anything near operating temperature, especially with the heat on. Too much heat radiates from the aluminum block to the environment. Start up, buckle up, check your mirrors, set the radio, wait for the garage door to close, and drive off conservatively. If it's fairly cold (like -15C, -20C or colder) usually there are some audible complaints from systems with thickened fluid - I'll give it 30 seconds then. Everything will warm up far faster under light load than sitting there idling. My little quirk that I'm sure no one else probably does - since my E39 days I manually set the HVAC to a very low fan speed. The automatic vent program would blow a small amount of air over the windshield in winter seasons so my breath didn't fog it up, but the HVAC fan wasn't blasting away stealing every little bit of heat from the engine when it's trying to warm up. Since my E90 days with the N52 and now with the N55, I actually have the HVAC system turned off for "short trips". On the N series engines the water pump doesn't even run if it doesn't have to. The exception is if there are potential visibility problems due to inside fogging, then I turn the fan to manual 1-3 segments (not AUTO). When I get some temp registering, if I'm going to be in the car for any distance then I set HVAC for AUTO and let it do its thing. In just a couple of km my oil temperature is off the 70C peg (heat exchanger between coolant/oil). As a long-term out-of-warranty used-car car-guy, I'm pretty happy about that and it hasn't really been an inconvenience. EDIT: I forgot to make it obvious - drive gently until oil temp comes up - no high revs, no heavy throttle except to avoid immediate danger. "High" and "Heavy" vary depending on just how cold it is, and what engine you have. ("gentle" on an S63 can move you a lot faster than "gentle" on a Corolla). Last edited by Surly73; 12-19-2021 at 06:16 AM.. |
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12-19-2021, 05:47 AM | #9 |
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Qsilver7 and Surly are 100% correct. Allowing an engine to idle when started cold is a leftover from the days of carbureted cars.
Since I've never actually owned a carbureted car I'm going on memory here, but I believe it was you had to let the car idle until the choke circuit on the carburetor switched off or the engine would not drive properly. The choke was a restriction in the air path that built extra manifold vacuum and drew in the additional fuel required to richen the mixture for proper combustion when cold. It's good practice to not rev the engine very high until oil temps are up to normal simply because oil doesn't work best when cold. Oil is also very thick when cold, and this resistance to flow can cause high oil pressures if the engine speed is too high. Many engines feature an oil filter bypass valve that will allow unfiltered oil into the engine if revved too high with cold oil - just one more reason not to. This is why some M cars have engine rev limiters that are lower when cold and gradually increase with oil temperature. As far as I know there's no immediate threat to any engine seals (valve seals included) from idling a cold engine. It's not impossible that valve seals could lack lubrication I guess, but that would be a massive oversight on the Engineering of an engine and not likely in my opinion. BMW Doctor's channel seems to rely heavily on the clickbait approach - use a flashy thumbnail and a provocative statement/question in the title to lure people in. I'm sure there's some good content in his channel, but I'm immediately skeptical of anyone who relies on questionable marketing to sell themselves. For example, how the heck would he know that valve seals in that particular engine are compromised by cold idling? Has he tested this? Set up experiments to prove his theory? Highly doubtful. He's probably using a bunch of anecdotal evidence to come to that conclusion, and that's not a scientifically sound approach. |
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12-19-2021, 05:47 PM | #10 |
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I just wait until the cold start RPM's settle down, e.g. 10-15 seconds, and then drive off. Usually need to get my android auto and music going anyhow, so it's time I would have spent idle anyhow.
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12-20-2021, 08:39 PM | #11 | ||
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12-20-2021, 08:41 PM | #12 |
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I have now picked up that exact practice it's a good thing the car has not been left to idle for a long period of time. A handful maybe on cold days this winter so far do to no longer having a garage. I'm building a carport
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12-20-2021, 09:24 PM | #13 | |
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I do find it kind of odd why would vehicle companies offer remote start for warming the car up if it causes unnecessary ware. My mom just got a brand new Volvo suv and it came with an app so she could remotely start her car while in the house or store prior to coming outside.
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12-21-2021, 07:42 AM | #14 | |
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12-22-2021, 05:18 AM | #15 | ||
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I just shake my head when I see my neighbors cars idling all the time. But hey, in the grand scheme of things gas is cheap and comfort is important! Lol |
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12-31-2021, 07:32 PM | #16 |
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All my vehicles - this. Settle to idle, drive conservatively until up to temp. Zero issues, multiple hundreds of thousands of miles across Land Rovers, BMW, and Jaguars. LRs and Jags have always seemed to warm up more quickly than BMW. I've always understood to warm up all drivetrain bits together rather than warm an engine and then go.
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01-30-2022, 11:30 PM | #17 | |||
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