[JK479]

I started to look again at buying a 5 series. Last fall i drove the 535i and 550i. Both were solid cars. Want to order one for june or july delivery. And i still love that 3 series sedan, but it will be replaced next spring which makes me hesitant on that car.


Some 5 series questions...
1. have they sorted out the steering yet? I heard they can replace a seal and calibrate and its much better.
2. if i find an 11 on the lot, are BMW Apps worth ordering instead of Sirius? Or is Sirius still a must have these days?
3. 6 speed. Yep still hell bent on owning a manual car. I am so removed from BMW, i wonder if I would be happy with a 535i stick after all the debating I did. My current car is a v6, but its nothing like the Turbo 6 in the 535i or turbo 8 in the 50i.
4. finally, graphite gray is growing on me. does it show swirl marks as much as black?
5. Does heads up display still cast a bad glare reflection on the march 2011

If anyone can chime in, i would greatly appreciate it. I think its time to get back into the brand. I drove a 550i last week and it seemed nice with the stick shift. It had the sterrign pull to the right, and i did notice it. Maybe its because i drive a lot of these cars. it seemed smooth and powerful, but also not the 400 hp i had remembered. I wasn't able to rev with the sales guy in the car though. But overall it seems like the right car for me. I still lament my old e60... but the new f10 is such a dramitic improvement in some areas besides the weight issue and steering feel.

thanks for your time or conversation on this...

[dr.mba]

Ok I may not be able to answer all your questions but I will give you my 2 cents worth.
1. Steering issue is unresolved to my knowledge as of yet. Multiple fixes out there that have been tried but still not 100% fix. Seems that it's more of an issue on pre September builds, so maybe keep that in mind when shopping.

2. BMW apps are of no interest to me. I find that the main reason I got a BMW is the car not the gadgets. If you're a hardcore twitter/face booker then perhaps. I have the siruius and didnt even bother activating it but that's me.

3. Manual/standard gearbox. I would have loved if I could do that but my wife frequently uses the car and she is not to be trusted with a stick as such I had to go for the next best (sport automatic transmission + paddles)

4. I have the graphite exterior. It does NOT show swirls at all. The one thing I noted though is it scratches easily but that seems to be an issue with all the new f10 paints that seem to be weak/fragile.

5. Cant vouch for HUD as I never liked the option and didn't tick the box when I ordered mine.

One thing I will mention is the car really transforms if you toggle to sport+ mode, my 535i feels like a totally different car if you compare normal to sport+ as it alters throttle response and revving. Maybe you should try it next time you drive one.
Sorry for the long post, help it's useful.

MBA

[JK479]

Originally Posted by dr.mba

Ok I may not be able to answer all your questions but I will give you my 2 cents worth.
1. Steering issue is unresolved to my knowledge as of yet. Multiple fixes out there that have been tried but still not 100% fix. Seems that it's more of an issue on pre September builds, so maybe keep that in mind when shopping.

2. BMW apps are of no interest to me. I find that the main reason I got a BMW is the car not the gadgets. If you're a hardcore twitter/face booker then perhaps. I have the siruius and didnt even bother activating it but that's me.

3. Manual/standard gearbox. I would have loved if I could do that but my wife frequently uses the car and she is not to be trusted with a stick as such I had to go for the next best (sport automatic transmission + paddles)

4. I have the graphite exterior. It does NOT show swirls at all. The one thing I noted though is it scratches easily but that seems to be an issue with all the new f10 paints that seem to be weak/fragile.

5. Cant vouch for HUD as I never liked the option and didn't tick the box when I ordered mine.

One thing I will mention is the car really transforms if you toggle to sport+ mode, my 535i feels like a totally different car if you compare normal to sport+ as it alters throttle response and revving. Maybe you should try it next time you drive one.
Sorry for the long post, help it's useful.



MBA

MBA : all excellent points. I just read another 535i delivered and no issue. maybe it was just the early build ones which makes me leary to try and buy a demo off the lot that definitely has the problem. I know its backed by bmw, but seems to be real problem...

[bfv]

1. have they sorted out the steering yet? I heard they can replace a seal and calibrate and its much better.

>>> No steering problems. My 528i is fine.

2. if i find an 11 on the lot, are BMW Apps worth ordering instead of Sirius? Or is Sirius still a must have these days?

>>>> More integration will follow current BMW apps. I would choose BMW apps instead of Sirius. Satellite radios will be history with the growth of free internet radios.

3. 6 speed. Yep still hell bent on owning a manual car. I am so removed from BMW, i wonder if I would be happy with a 535i stick after all the debating I did. My current car is a v6, but its nothing like the Turbo 6 in the 535i or turbo 8 in the 50i.

>>> Your preference, but I forgot about manual when I saw AT with great fuel efficiency and performance.
4. finally, graphite gray is growing on me. does it show swirl marks as much as black?


5. Does heads up display still cast a bad glare reflection on the march 2011

>>>> There will be some glare but if you can afford to add all gooddies, go for heads up display. New March 2011 HUDs are nice.

Basically, forget the one on the lot, order one and be happy!


Personal suggestions:

1) Cold weather package.
2) Active ventilated seats.
3) Side/top/rear cameras.
4) Premium 2 package.
5) Multi-contour seats (if not taking sports package).

V

[Bandini3]

3. 6 speed. Yep still hell bent on owning a manual car. I am so removed from BMW, i wonder if I would be happy with a 535i stick after all the debating I did.
------------------------
I have had three BMWs with manual including my current 3-Series. But, when I buy an F10 it will definitely be an automatic.

Obviously this is a personal choice, but I would make the following argument in favour of the Sports Automatic.

1. The 8-speed automatic has one fundamental advantage over the 6-speed manual because it offers (A) lower (or 'shorter') overall gearing in the first three gears, to achieve more rapid acceleration, and (B) higher (or 'taller') overall gearing in its top two gears (7 & 8). The result: the AT version can usually accelerate faster than the manual version, while achieving lower fuel consumption (highway: better by 12-15% on 535i).

2. Many automotive experts believe a modern AT is well suited to turbo engines (including the 6-speed on the 335i) because gear changes are completed very quickly, with minimal drop-off in engine RPM, so the turbo doesn't have to spool up and down significantly with each gear change. This steady RPM and steady gas flow allows the turbo to work more effectively, with minimal power interruption. This contributes to improved acceleration.

3. The 8-speed AT obviously offers closer spacing of gears than a 6-speed, making it easier to find the right gear in any particular driving situation.

4. When you get tired of playing with the AT paddle shifters (say, in city traffic), you can select automatic and relax.

All that being said, I admit you don't feel quite so 'connected' with the AT as you do with a manual. (In a Porsche 911, I'd be inclined to choose the manual.)

My 4c

[LuvMyE92]

Originally Posted by Bandini3

Obviously this is a personal choice, but I would make the following argument in favour of the Sports Automatic.

Bandini makes some good points, but I would also suggest to the OP and others that are considering it to read some of the threads here and all of the complaints about "jerky acceleration" and sometimes obtuse, confusing and confusing automatic transmission programming. 8 gears means that the car is doing a lot of shifting. In normal traffic, you'd likely find the car already in 8th gear by the time you get to 45 MPH whereas I'm still in third at the peak of my torque curve ready to accelerate madly if need be. Yeah, yeah, you've got your flippity paddles and all that rot with your "sports" automatic so that you can drive it almost like a manual, but I've never been happy with how those things respond.

And as for the turbo spooling mentioned, I've noticed no lag or issues with same while shifting.

Now - that said - the OP also needs to do more research and read the threads on steering issues. I'm not sure that it's all been resolved.

And if you do go with the manual, be sure to have the CDV removed ASAP.

There are other issues with these cars, some common, many uncommon. I would suggest that the OP do more research if he has any doubts. Personally, I wish I had waited. Eh, hindsight.

[JK479]

Originally Posted by LuvMyE92

Bandini makes some good points, but I would also suggest to the OP and others that are considering it to read some of the threads here and all of the complaints about "jerky acceleration" and sometimes obtuse, confusing and confusing automatic transmission programming. 8 gears means that the car is doing a lot of shifting. In normal traffic, you'd likely find the car already in 8th gear by the time you get to 45 MPH whereas I'm still in third at the peak of my torque curve ready to accelerate madly if need be. Yeah, yeah, you've got your flippity paddles and all that rot with your "sports" automatic so that you can drive it almost like a manual, but I've never been happy with how those things respond.

And as for the turbo spooling mentioned, I've noticed no lag or issues with same while shifting.

Now - that said - the OP also needs to do more research and read the threads on steering issues. I'm not sure that it's all been resolved.

And if you do go with the manual, be sure to have the CDV removed ASAP.

There are other issues with these cars, some common, many uncommon. I would suggest that the OP do more research if he has any doubts. Personally, I wish I had waited. Eh, hindsight.

Hi Luv e92... can the dealer remove the CDV, or is it easy for me to do it?

[JK479]

Originally Posted by bfv

1. have they sorted out the steering yet? I heard they can replace a seal and calibrate and its much better.

>>> No steering problems. My 528i is fine.

2. if i find an 11 on the lot, are BMW Apps worth ordering instead of Sirius? Or is Sirius still a must have these days?

>>>> More integration will follow current BMW apps. I would choose BMW apps instead of Sirius. Satellite radios will be history with the growth of free internet radios.

3. 6 speed. Yep still hell bent on owning a manual car. I am so removed from BMW, i wonder if I would be happy with a 535i stick after all the debating I did. My current car is a v6, but its nothing like the Turbo 6 in the 535i or turbo 8 in the 50i.

>>> Your preference, but I forgot about manual when I saw AT with great fuel efficiency and performance.
4. finally, graphite gray is growing on me. does it show swirl marks as much as black?


5. Does heads up display still cast a bad glare reflection on the march 2011

>>>> There will be some glare but if you can afford to add all gooddies, go for heads up display. New March 2011 HUDs are nice.

Basically, forget the one on the lot, order one and be happy!


Personal suggestions:

1) Cold weather package.
2) Active ventilated seats.
3) Side/top/rear cameras.
4) Premium 2 package.
5) Multi-contour seats (if not taking sports package).

V

Excellent post... I would be doing a sport pack, rwd obviously with the 6 speed. I am a little worried if i go with all the goodies, and get a 535i, does a car like this really just need the big v8....

Really... side cameras? its a fun option forsure... its not the expensive of an option... I also like the black roof lining... i do not see it a lot, but helps the black interior look better...

[JK479]

Originally Posted by Bandini3

3. 6 speed. Yep still hell bent on owning a manual car. I am so removed from BMW, i wonder if I would be happy with a 535i stick after all the debating I did.
------------------------
I have had three BMWs with manual including my current 3-Series. But, when I buy an F10 it will definitely be an automatic.

Obviously this is a personal choice, but I would make the following argument in favour of the Sports Automatic.

1. The 8-speed automatic has one fundamental advantage over the 6-speed manual because it offers (A) lower (or 'shorter') overall gearing in the first three gears, to achieve more rapid acceleration, and (B) higher (or 'taller') overall gearing in its top two gears (7 & 8). The result: the AT version can usually accelerate faster than the manual version, while achieving lower fuel consumption (highway: better by 12-15% on 535i).

2. Many automotive experts believe a modern AT is well suited to turbo engines (including the 6-speed on the 335i) because gear changes are completed very quickly, with minimal drop-off in engine RPM, so the turbo doesn't have to spool up and down significantly with each gear change. This steady RPM and steady gas flow allows the turbo to work more effectively, with minimal power interruption. This contributes to improved acceleration.

3. The 8-speed AT obviously offers closer spacing of gears than a 6-speed, making it easier to find the right gear in any particular driving situation.

4. When you get tired of playing with the AT paddle shifters (say, in city traffic), you can select automatic and relax.

All that being said, I admit you don't feel quite so 'connected' with the AT as you do with a manual. (In a Porsche 911, I'd be inclined to choose the manual.)

My 4c

Funny you should mention 6 speed in a porsche. Its the car I sold so i could get a BMW. 911 with 6 speeds. And i found the transmission very bulky, notchy and not nearly as precise and pleasurable to drive than a BMW. Funny how things work out.

The 8 speed in the 5 is formidable. But i have sampled the 6 speed, and love the smooth engagement and the way you are able to pilot the beast. If i do 400 HP, its sort of fun to drop the gears around 50mph to 2nd and just feel the amazing power the car has to offer. I find with DCT and Automatics, its hard to drop to a precise gear like that when you really want to. But i agree with efficieny, the auto is still smarter than my 16 years of driving a manual...

[JK479]

Originally Posted by LuvMyE92

Bandini makes some good points, but I would also suggest to the OP and others that are considering it to read some of the threads here and all of the complaints about "jerky acceleration" and sometimes obtuse, confusing and confusing automatic transmission programming. 8 gears means that the car is doing a lot of shifting. In normal traffic, you'd likely find the car already in 8th gear by the time you get to 45 MPH whereas I'm still in third at the peak of my torque curve ready to accelerate madly if need be. Yeah, yeah, you've got your flippity paddles and all that rot with your "sports" automatic so that you can drive it almost like a manual, but I've never been happy with how those things respond.

And as for the turbo spooling mentioned, I've noticed no lag or issues with same while shifting.

Now - that said - the OP also needs to do more research and read the threads on steering issues. I'm not sure that it's all been resolved.

And if you do go with the manual, be sure to have the CDV removed ASAP.

There are other issues with these cars, some common, many uncommon. I would suggest that the OP do more research if he has any doubts. Personally, I wish I had waited. Eh, hindsight.

Do you really find the 300 HP rich enough to get the 535i up to speeds fast... I feel like this car needs a little more HP to back the increased heft which is really just better safer build condtruction which i am happy with.

The last e60 with 300 hp was lighter, but as i recall it was also not as safe on side impact. BMW really went to town this time...

[scottz5]

Originally Posted by jk3355

Do you really find the 300 HP rich enough to get the 535i up to speeds fast... I feel like this car needs a little more HP to back the increased heft which is really just better safer build condtruction which i am happy with.

The last e60 with 300 hp was lighter, but as i recall it was also not as safe on side impact. BMW really went to town this time...

My buddy that has a 550 and I like my 535 better. I think with the sports auto the 300 hp feels right. I know his car is a little faster but we both like the feel of the 535.

[JK479]

Originally Posted by scottz5

My buddy that has a 550 and I like my 535 better. I think with the sports auto the 300 hp feels right. I know his car is a little faster but we both like the feel of the 535.

Thanks for that interesting feed back.

I think the 8 speed and 300 HP I6 work well together.

I just wonder if the 6 speed on the I6 will feel powerful. I did have a very minor chance to drive the 6 speed 535i when it first came out. But i was unable to tell if the car had serious pep since it was a sold car.

I know it will be smooth, but will it feel as powerful as the e60 535i, which i think was BMW's benchmark coming in.

I know the tq is now availiable at 1200 rpm, so in theory the 300 lbs comes sooner a little... but is it enough to move 4000lbs around...

they say its a 5.7 0-60 run, but all the websites i come across say its 6.0. Not really fast when you think about all the cars out there that hustle to 60 now, including turbo kias, even the Lexus Es350 is about that quick.

But i see your point about balance...

[bfv]

Originally Posted by jk3355

Excellent post... Really... side cameras? its a fun option forsure... its not the expensive of an option...

Side cameras with top view is a blessing if you are traveling regularly to congested areas, parking etc.

[JK479]

Originally Posted by bfv

Side cameras with top view is a blessing if you are traveling regularly to congested areas, parking etc.

You know, i might just have to click the option box. I bet few actually ordered from dealers have it. Just one more way to make your f10 unique...

Also the black headliner... can't see why everyone does not click the option, it matches up well with the black dash...

I am still on the fense about comfort closign doors and truck. I like the idea of having it.

I have also decided not to grab the heads up, savign 1300 on that is okay...

[ibimmer954]

I have the 535i 6MT. I used to own a 6AT 335i E93. Does the 535i accelerate like the 335i? No, it does not. The N55 has a "smoother" and less "boosty" feel to it on the 535i 6MT. I drove a 328i once and I think the 535i feels more like that. Very linear acceleration feel. The car may not feel as fast but I think it still gets going pretty well. I have also driven the 550i. The V8 definitely feels a lot faster, but I like the sound and linear feedback of the I6 better. The V8 sounds pretty "growly" to me.

The 6MT is very smooth. The clutch doesn't have a strong engagement point. Just progressive linear engagement. Maybe that's a CDV doing the job, but it feels good to me. The shifter feel is excellent. Very smooth, short, precise throws. It's wonderful to use. As good as my old 6MT Acura TSX if not better.

[bfv]

Originally Posted by jk3355

You know, i might just have to click the option box. I bet few actually ordered from dealers have it. Just one more way to make your f10 unique...

Also the black headliner... can't see why everyone does not click the option, it matches up well with the black dash...

I am still on the fense about comfort closign doors and truck. I like the idea of having it.

I have also decided not to grab the heads up, savign 1300 on that is okay...

1) Side/top view cams also show parking and turning lines (if you look at videos on bmwusa.com for 5 series, you'll know what I'm talking about). I find that these lines correlated exactly with turning radius and found them very helpful in maneuvering this large car in odd & rather tough places.

2) You should look at main instrument cluster panel that comes with heads up display. The new panel is Gorgeous. I wish I had it. Unless BMW offers new instrument cluster panel as standard , i would strongly recommend heads up display.

[JK479]

Originally Posted by ibimmer346

I have the 535i 6MT. I used to own a 6AT 335i E93. Does the 535i accelerate like the 335i? No, it does not. The N55 has a "smoother" and less "boosty" feel to it on the 535i 6MT. I drove a 328i once and I think the 535i feels more like that. Very linear acceleration feel. The car may not feel as fast but I think it still gets going pretty well. I have also driven the 550i. The V8 definitely feels a lot faster, but I like the sound and linear feedback of the I6 better. The V8 sounds pretty "growly" to me.

The 6MT is very smooth. The clutch doesn't have a strong engagement point. Just progressive linear engagement. Maybe that's a CDV doing the job, but it feels good to me. The shifter feel is excellent. Very smooth, short, precise throws. It's wonderful to use. As good as my old 6MT Acura TSX if not better.

I love the fact this transmission rivals that of an Acura. I know exactly what you mean by smooth, Acura 6 speeds are some of the best in the business.

Have you ever foudn yourself saying, this car needs about 30 hp more to make it fast? Or is that just what a 550i is for?

I'd love to stay with the I6 if I knew it would satisfy my speed requests. Thing is, my old e60 felt so light on its feet and nimble. Does the new 535i feel close with dynamic drive...

[Bandini3]

Originally Posted by jk3355

I love the fact this transmission rivals that of an Acura. I know exactly what you mean by smooth, Acura 6 speeds are some of the best in the business.

Have you ever foudn yourself saying, this car needs about 30 hp more to make it fast? Or is that just what a 550i is for?

I'd love to stay with the I6 if I knew it would satisfy my speed requests. Thing is, my old e60 felt so light on its feet and nimble. Does the new 535i feel close with dynamic drive...

I believe the 535i vs. 550i debate has been covered in a number of posts, but perhaps you could craft an interesting new thread and get the latest opinions from current owners. (i.e. any 535i owners convinced they need more hp? I'd hazard to guess not many 550i owners would complain about excessive power)

I am just at the test-drive stage, but my impression was that the 550i had great power (more than I'd use 99% of the time), while the 535i had pretty decent power ('spirited', if not overwhelming). The 535i felt better balanced on the test drive, but that may have been just the power of suggestion (several published reviews commented on the weight of the 550i).

[JK479]

Originally Posted by Bandini3

I believe the 535i vs. 550i debate has been covered in a number of posts, but perhaps you could craft an interesting new thread and get the latest opinions from current owners. (i.e. any 535i owners convinced they need more hp? I'd hazard to guess not many 550i owners would complain about excessive power)

I am just at the test-drive stage, but my impression was that the 550i had great power (more than I'd use 99% of the time), while the 535i had pretty decent power ('spirited', if not overwhelming). The 535i felt better balanced on the test drive, but that may have been just the power of suggestion (several published reviews commented on the weight of the 550i).

I like your thinking Bandini... i would have to start things off by saying i know its been covered before... but what do people think now. Its so hard in the North East to even find a rwd i now. All the dealers stock just xdrive. It makes it almost imposible to find a stick shift or even rwd now.

And I have a feeling some will tell me to just wait for the M5, but i am positive its going to be well out of my price range. The 550i stick is as close as you can get to M5 power without an m5 price.

I also feel as though if BMW upped the HP on the 535i a little, it would give it more of an exclusive nature. Does anyone have a problem that the 335i has the same hp as the 535i. I know its more about driving dynamics, but it would have been nice to atleast give a little separation to the two cars.

It makes me even debate the 335i in the same category of the 5 on a lease purchase. I know they are both very different cars, but they can both be had as rwd, 6 speed manuals, so one has to wonder if its worth it to step down to an outgoing model to save money, or go with the latest and greatest and a little heavier 535i. Its got features the 335i could only dream about. Or just go full steam ahead to the 550i. And take no prisioners!