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      06-12-2012, 08:27 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by yxc145 View Post
wait.. I am a little confused. The driver drove within speed limit and signaled. Why was he/she being pulled over?
Because he was TRAVELING in the left lane, which is the high-speed passing lane. Legally, he is only allowed to use that lane for short distances to overtake cars in the middle (traveling) lane.

Original poster here. It was late at night, and that stretch of the road is 4 lanes, narrowing to three. The offender was in the left lane for the whole time. I was in the right lane, and there were no other cars around.

FWIW, here in Massachusetts, there are now signs that point out that travel in the passing lane is illegal. It was great to see it enforced. And it's not an isolated incident. Another of my friends was in the left lane, and he got pulled over. The cop gave him a warning (nice of him), but he also was really mad and yelled at him (which I think was unnecessary). OTOH, my friend now doesn't hog the left lane. (One less Ford SUV blocking traffic!)
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      06-13-2012, 06:51 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by BigKutta View Post
2 second rule as documented in Wikipedia:

The two-second rule is a rule of thumb by which a driver may maintain a safe following distance at any speed. The rule is that a driver should ideally stay at least two seconds behind any vehicle that is directly in front of the driver's vehicle.

The two-second rule is useful as it can be applied to any speed. It is equivalent to one vehicle-length for every 8 km/h (5 mph) of the current speed, but drivers can find it difficult to estimate the correct distance from the car in front, let alone to remember the stopping distances that are required for a given speed, or to compute the linear equation on the fly. The two-second rule gets around these problems, and provides a simple and common-sense way of improving road safety.

The practice has been shown to dramatically reduce risk of collision, and also the severity of an accident should an accident occur. It also helps to avoid tailgating and road rage for all drivers.

The risk of tailgating is largely caused by the accident avoidance time being much less than the driver reaction time. Driving instructors advocate that drivers always use the "two-second rule" regardless of speed or the type of road. During adverse weather or hazardous conditions such as black ice, it is important to maintain an even greater distance of three or four seconds.
The two-second rule tells a defensive driver the minimum distance needed to reduce the risk of collision under ideal driving conditions. The allotted two-seconds is a safety buffer, to allow the following driver time to respond.

To estimate the time, a driver can wait until the rear end of the vehicle in front passes any distinct and fixed point on the roadway - e.g. a road sign, mailbox, line/crack/patch in the road. However, don't take your eyes off the vehicle for more than a second or that would defeat the purpose. As you count to yourself the elapsed time in seconds, the front of your car should pass the same point no less than two seconds later. If the elapsed time is less than this, increase the distance, then repeat the method again until the time is at least 2 seconds.

One can count the duration of time simply by saying "zero... one... two" but for greater accuracy, it is suggested that drivers say "only a fool breaks the two-second rule". At a normal speaking rate, this sentence takes approximately two seconds to say, and serves as a reminder to the driver of the importance of the rule itself.
Thanks for the informative post.
I did my own time keeping today and I must say that 2 seconds is exaggerated. I would say 1 second should be enough, you'll still have enough reaction time as long as you look ahead to see what's happening in front of the guy driving in front of you.

Maybe the 2 seconds are necessary for the average American driver who's talking on the cellphone pressed against the ear with the shoulder, and holding an iced coffee cup on the other hand while still managing to drive at 70 mph in the highway?
(j/k)
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      06-13-2012, 08:17 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhinosaur View Post
Thanks for the informative post.
I did my own time keeping today and I must say that 2 seconds is exaggerated. I would say 1 second should be enough, you'll still have enough reaction time as long as you look ahead to see what's happening in front of the guy driving in front of you.

Maybe the 2 seconds are necessary for the average American driver who's talking on the cellphone pressed against the ear with the shoulder, and holding an iced coffee cup on the other hand while still managing to drive at 70 mph in the highway?
(j/k)
Sure, 1-2 seconds is more than enough response time, especially in a BMW that can stop a dime. However, I find the 2 second rule very useful and right on because it allows you to maintain enough distance to accommodate the idiot in front of you who is always riding his brakes or driving at inconsistent speeds because he is right up someone's ass. The 2 seconds will ensure you dont have to do that. I have increased time to 3 seconds in really slow stop-and-go, and have never had to hit my brakes once for miles. Its very useful and you can change the time gap to your liking and depending upon the driving circumstance.
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      06-13-2012, 09:05 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhinosaur View Post
Thanks for the informative post.
I did my own time keeping today and I must say that 2 seconds is exaggerated. I would say 1 second should be enough, you'll still have enough reaction time as long as you look ahead to see what's happening in front of the guy driving in front of you.

Maybe the 2 seconds are necessary for the average American driver who's talking on the cellphone pressed against the ear with the shoulder, and holding an iced coffee cup on the other hand while still managing to drive at 70 mph in the highway?
(j/k)
What if the brakes in the car behind you is not as good as your BMW's brakes?
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      06-13-2012, 09:06 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by MBrown1003 View Post
FWIW, here in Massachusetts, there are now signs that point out that travel in the passing lane is illegal. It was great to see it enforced.
I dont think I have ever seen one of those signs in MA.
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      06-13-2012, 06:15 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
What if the brakes in the car behind you is not as good as your BMW's brakes?
S/He'll have 1 second to react. It's more than enough as long as you're not snoozing on the fast lane.
In Europe no one hogs the left lane, it just doesn't normally happen because it is encoded in our mindset that you cannot just stay in the left lane. As a result, drivers on the left lane are normally very focused while they are there and react quickly. I would assume that I would have to adopt a different behavior in the US but here in Europe one second is enough as long as you don't hog the left lane.
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      06-14-2012, 07:11 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
I dont think I have ever seen one of those signs in MA.
The signs are beginning to appear on more highways. I have seen them around Boston. I believe it was on Route 128/95 south of Boston. You say you drive 75 in the passing lane around Boston? I think you know that is middle lane speed for most cars. Making a faster car go around you to the right is not a safe thing to do. It is also interesting to me that when I am coming up I93 from Boston to New Hampshire you often see a long line of left lane hogs going 65 to 75 and this line can stretch to 30 or more vehicles. The odd thing is that the far right lane is often empty and that becomes the only way to get around this long line. A BMW can accelerate quickly enough to get around this moving roadblock, but it is not the optimum way to do this as cars do enter and exit the highway from this lane.

I have noticed lately that left lane hogs are beginning to pull back into the travel lane more often. There are still the obstinent drivers who have chosen a speed, let's say, of 75 miles per hour, as the appropriate allowable speed and
will not move over for anyone (except more frequently now the police) but they are putting other vehicles at risk as other drivers who may choose 77 miles per hour as their cruising speed.

Drivers should pass and then pull back into the travel lane. It is the law. Going 75 is speeding as much as 80 is. It will allow for safe passing for all vehicles. That is why the police are begining to pay more attention to this safety hazard.
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      06-14-2012, 07:42 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by The X Men View Post

Seriously, the thing that bothers me the most is tailgater on the highway. If I am doing 75 MPH on the left lane, people should just go around me if they want to pass. In Europe, there are police traps on the highway to catch drivers tailgating, we should do the same here in the US.
If you are being tailgated it may mean the car behind you wants to pass you. Move over to the travel lane. I drive most often in the travel lane and I am rarely tailgated. Letting people pass allows for a stress free ride. Who am I to determine how others should drive, that is law enforcement's job.
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      06-14-2012, 08:21 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by rhinosaur View Post
S/He'll have 1 second to react. It's more than enough as long as you're not snoozing on the fast lane.
In Europe no one hogs the left lane, it just doesn't normally happen because it is encoded in our mindset that you cannot just stay in the left lane. As a result, drivers on the left lane are normally very focused while they are there and react quickly. I would assume that I would have to adopt a different behavior in the US but here in Europe one second is enough as long as you don't hog the left lane.
You are assuming that when you applied max braking the car behind you also apply max braking at the same time. More often, the car behind start by slight braking, then they realize they need more braking, but by that time, the 1 second gap is eliminated.
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      06-14-2012, 08:27 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by kirbyj View Post
If you are being tailgated it may mean the car behind you wants to pass you. Move over to the travel lane. I drive most often in the travel lane and I am rarely tailgated. Letting people pass allows for a stress free ride. Who am I to determine how others should drive, that is law enforcement's job.
Not very often can I go above 75 MPH inside of 128, when I go up to NH, I am doing 80-85. Believe me, I am not a slow driver, I go with the flow of traffic. If I am doing 75 MPH and someone want to cruise at 77, they can slow down or pass me, 75 is the flow of traffic. Lets just say if I let them pass and they are cruising at 77, I decided that now I want to cruise at 80 MPH. I can be a jerk and tailgate them as well, and my bet is that they will not move over. In my option, its actually safer for me to pass him on the right instead of tailgating him.
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      06-14-2012, 08:37 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
Not very often can I go above 75 MPH inside of 128, when I go up to NH, I am doing 80-85. Believe me, I am not a slow driver, I go with the flow of traffic. If I am doing 75 MPH and someone want to cruise at 77, they can slow down or pass me, 75 is the flow of traffic. Lets just say if I let them pass and they are cruising at 77, I decided that now I want to cruise at 80 MPH. I can be a jerk and tailgate them as well, and my bet is that they will not move over. In my option, its actually safer for me to pass him on the right instead of tailgating him.
Now, if everyone followed the rules and used the passing lane for passing, then you wouldn't need to come up with these scenarios. You move to the open left lane, pass, and move back over to the travel lane. The left lane is for passing only and not for going with the "flow of traffic". This is the whole concept.

In the US, everyone makes their own rules and think they are right. The "flow of traffic" should be in the travel lanes only. I understand that everyone does what you say, but that doesn't make it right.
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      06-14-2012, 01:09 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by BigKutta View Post
Now, if everyone followed the rules and used the passing lane for passing, then you wouldn't need to come up with these scenarios. You move to the open left lane, pass, and move back over to the travel lane. The left lane is for passing only and not for going with the "flow of traffic". This is the whole concept.

In the US, everyone makes their own rules and think they are right. The "flow of traffic" should be in the travel lanes only. I understand that everyone does what you say, but that doesn't make it right.
Traffic is bad enough in Boston as it is, if everyone use the left lane for passing only, that would essentially reduce a 3 lane highway into 2 lane, which in turn will cause even more traffic.
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      06-14-2012, 03:11 PM   #35
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I get it now. If you want to drive at the speed of traffic you get into the far left lane on a multilane highway and stay in that lane for as long as you like. You do not let other drivers pass you because you are going fast enough. If they really want to pass you they should weave in and out of the other three lanes on the highway.

I see your point. It also illustrates my prior post that often the far right lane is often empty on these three and four lane roads.

Thank you for making me understand the rationale of these drivers who don't move over to let faster cars go by. I always thought it was a conscious decision by these drivers to not let anyone pass them. That is why I never bother to come up behind such a driver, and if I do approach them I am usually in the travel lane and just keep going right past them. They don't seem to mind and at least they don't do what people often did twenty or more years ago which was to abruptly pull into the right lane if anyone tried to pass them on the right. I have had this happen in Vermont and Maine where there was only two lanes. That has always been one of my concerns when passing on the right that someone would cut me off. That is why I often go over another lane to the right to avoid that possibility, especially if I am on my motorcycle. So X Men I guess it is good that you don't feel threatened by someone passing you on the right. I have noticed that no one is bothered by that anymore in the metropolitan areas. Be careful in the countryside.
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      06-15-2012, 12:54 PM   #36
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kirbyj settle down my friend, you sound like you are going to have a heart attack. You probably drive like you write post on forums.
Like I said before, if the right lanes are empty, I usually travel in the right lane. If there is traffic, I use the left lane as a travel lane like everybody else. What I cannot stand is drivers who tailgate me in the left lane when there is traffic and I am going with the flow of traffic.
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      06-15-2012, 06:25 PM   #37
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It is not important to me to have the last word.
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      06-16-2012, 02:34 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
I dont think I have ever seen one of those signs in MA.
They have them in several places on the Mass Pike, including near the State Police barracks in Weston. I also saw one on Route 3 on my way to the Cape this morning. They're not fixed signs -- they're on the signs that flash variable messages.
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      06-16-2012, 02:49 PM   #39
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Thats why there is no lane morale here in California, people driving slightly or at speed limit thinks they're entitled to the left lane. Even when I'm driving 80, when I see somebody coming up behind me then I just move over. If they want to get a ticket that's up to them. If I dont want to move over then I'll get on the gas, that's my problem if I get cited.

If you dont want to drive fast(er) then get out of the way. You're not doing anyone a favor by blocking or impeding the traffic.
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      06-16-2012, 04:51 PM   #40
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The X Men is a left lane bandit
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      06-17-2012, 11:16 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men
Quote:
Originally Posted by MBrown1003 View Post
Driving home tonight, I watched a Mercury Marquis being followed by a State Police cruiser. Marquis driver went through a toll, signaled, and settled into the left lane (in light traffic) doing about 60 - 65 MPH in a 65 MPH zone. I settled into the right lane doing about the same speed. Less than a mile later, the lights went on and the Marquis got pulled over. YES! YES! YES! Hopefully that's one selfish, unaware driver educated on proper lane discipline!!
That was probably some old lady that got pull over and now she have to use her SS check which was meant for food and rent to pay for her ticket

Seriously, the thing that bothers me the most is tailgater on the highway. If I am doing 75 MPH on the left lane, people should just go around me if they want to pass. In Europe, there are police traps on the highway to catch drivers tailgating, we should do the same here in the US.
Sorry, you should get the h3ll out of the left lane if someone is trying to pass you.
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      06-17-2012, 11:40 PM   #42
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If someone is coming up faster than you, get out of the way. It doesn't matter how fast YOU are going.
Passing on the right is illegal, if you are in the way and in the left lane (especially the farthest most left), you need to GTFO of the way.
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      06-18-2012, 02:04 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhinosaur View Post
Thanks for the informative post.
I did my own time keeping today and I must say that 2 seconds is exaggerated. I would say 1 second should be enough, you'll still have enough reaction time as long as you look ahead to see what's happening in front of the guy driving in front of you.

Maybe the 2 seconds are necessary for the average American driver who's talking on the cellphone pressed against the ear with the shoulder, and holding an iced coffee cup on the other hand while still managing to drive at 70 mph in the highway?
(j/k)
Wohaa what a statement !
In Norway the rule is 3 seconds, and the reason is to make sure you don't collide with the car in front of you, if he needs to panic breake.
Really simple really, why do you want to push this few seconds?
Will you arrive 2 seconds earlier at destination :-)

Have a look here http://www.visualexpert.com/Resources/reactiontime.html
So in verry best case, you will have 0,3 seconds to not hit the car infront of you if they panic breake, again why is this important ?
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      06-18-2012, 08:28 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Fantasm View Post
If someone is coming up faster than you, get out of the way. It doesn't matter how fast YOU are going.
Passing on the right is illegal, if you are in the way and in the left lane (especially the farthest most left), you need to GTFO of the way.
If we go by the law word for word, you are not suppose to be on the left lane at all, left lane is the passing lane, you are suppose to pass a slower car on the right lane and then get back on the right lane afterward.
The situation I am talking about is when there is a line of cars in the left lane all going about 10 to 15 MPH above the speed limit. Some A hole decided that he wants to go faster somehow and tailgates me. Am I suppose to move over to the right lane and let him go 10 feet in front of me in the line of car and then I can get back on the left lane after that drive behind him?
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