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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BMW 5-Series (F10) Forums General 5-Series Sedan and Wagon (F10 / F11) Forum test drive of 530d with view to trading in my e39 530i msport
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      02-26-2012, 11:50 AM   #1
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test drive of 530d with view to trading in my e39 530i msport

Had a test drive this morning in a 1 year old 530D SE with a view to trading in my beloved e39 530i Msport.
Aim is to buy a F10 530d msport with a load of options.

My view of the 530d SE is this :-

Steering - well plenty of chat on these forums about this but coming from the E39 it is light. You get used to it for sure but its no way as good as the E39. When I got back into it the sterring just felt considerablyt better. I'd give the 39 sterring 10/10 but the F10 say 5/10. It does the job but it could be so much better and feed back more of what the front wheels are doing.In the E39 you can feel what the tyres are doing , the F10 is rather numb in comparison.This SE didn't have the sport mode so couldn't verify how much better the sport mode might be in terms of weighting .

Engine. Well the 3 litre diesel really is very good in deed. At idle, you can tell its a diesel but once on the move, its very refined and smooth and the power is effortless. As soon as you press down on the loud pedal, it just goes. It makes a nice noise when accelrating and if you floor it, blimey does it go!

Interior is fine, I did notice the reflections in thge windsfreen that have also been mentioned on these forums of the speaker and where the HUD would be, this only occured with the sun ahead of the car. With the sun behind these went away. No issues with this on a E39 at all.

I'm not sure you need a bong to go off when you enter the car, whats that about? (A bong should be to indicate a potential issue)

The car had the standard part electric seats, felt they didn't go up high enough, I prefer to sit as high as I can - are the fully electric versions any better?
The dash seems higher (as the bonnet is quite high) and this may contributre to the feeling of sitting lower.

Despite the car being only 2 inches wider and 5 inches longer, it feels liek such a largeer car. (in fact the new F30 is not much shorter than a e39 and is in fact 1 inch wider )

The headlining also feels inferior to the one fitted in my e39. The e39 had an athracite sort of fuzzy felt material but the F10 feels a bit cheap and plasticky. So would opt for the alacantara one instead, that adds £785 to the order and potentially adds a month to the delivery time.

Must admit I came away a little disapointed as it didn't have that wow factor that I felt when I first drove an e39 years ago. In some way its not as good,(steering, reflections) its almost as if it was designed by a bunch of new people who hadn't driven a E39 but had just read about one.(just ,my view!)
Biggest advantage was the engine, very impressed with that and the gadgets that you can now get. HUD will be good!

In msport guise, its a very nice looking bit of kit though.

Anyone bought a F10 coming from a E39 and had similar thoughts / regrets?
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      02-27-2012, 04:11 AM   #2
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I come from an E39(2001) 525 to a F10(2011) 535.

I bought it in England and drove it home to Sweden(2000km) so I had gotten used to it by the time i was home again, and sat in my old e39 which I had not yet sold at the time.

So I would say I was in a very good position to compare the two. Ofcourse the e39 was 10 years old and some of the negatives ofcourse come from aging.

Steering:
Yes its light, the servo-motor is really strong. But you get used to it. And when you do, the old e39 steering feels so heavy you wonder if the servo is helping at all(slight exaggeration). I love the new steering. It did take me a longer than I though to adapt to parking with it though.

Engine:
Forget about it, no comparison. But I did upgrade quite a bit from 192 to 306 hp.

Interior:
Like going from medieval to 2011. My e39 felt old inside when I sat in it again.
I also had the anthratcite roof in my old car, and have the standard roof in the new, no issues with it. The quality of everything inside are miles beyond the e39.

Size:
yes its big, and it is alittle trickier to park with it no doubt.

Seats:
I have the Comfort Seats, which are awesome, very comfortable and adjustable. I also felt you sat really low comapred to the e39, the console just towered up around me when I sat in it for the first time. But in the end it feels more cozy sitting low and I dont feel its too low now.

My first reaction was the exact opposite of yours, when I walked away from the first testing I was blown away about how much better this new vehicle was that I just had to upgrade.
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      02-27-2012, 06:00 AM   #3
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thanks for the reply, i guess as you say with the steering, you get used to it, but I still think it inferior.
I think with the way the rules on emissions are going, this is going to be norm now.( I think I'm right in saying the new 911 has EPS and thats not had great feedback)

Engine , yes very good. Arguably not as refined / quiet as a petrol and its not a 550i , but very quick and smooth once going all the same.

agree on size, it does feel like to be a much bigger car. I'm going to go for the rear parking camera given I have to park it in a tight spot.

interior, I alwasy thoought he E39 was goodquality inside, it does look a little dated as does the exterior (the SE more than the msport IMHO) but still a good looking car. The F10 in msport looks great from outside and inside , well styles have moved on.

Just mixed emotions given I've had the E39 for ten years now and its been a very good car to me, the best by a very long shot.Takes some beating and I think in general the F10 is here in most places but not perfect in my opinion. (Every car is a compromise)
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      02-27-2012, 01:24 PM   #4
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I owned my E39 M5 at the same time that I owned the F10 535.

Now I own only the M5. If I had gotten rid of it when I bought the 535, I probably wouldn't have noticed how bad the steering is, how poorly the engine ran and the annoying often failing i-drive. Since I still had the E39 and drove both, it got to the point that I couldn't stand the 535 and sold it.

Keep your car. It's the best thing BMW ever made.
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      02-27-2012, 02:23 PM   #5
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well 'luvmye92' i think you may be right that th e39 was the best bmw built.
It just feels so right, this is really making me think. Unfortunaltely I don't have the space to keep 2 cars so its one or the other.
Sure the gadgets have moved on , thts to be expected , but is the F10 the ultimate driving machine?. No its not. Is it good, sure but it could be better.

I've tried contacting BMW back in April last year to complian about the sterring and hee's the reply for you info.

"We invest a great deal into the design and manufacture of all our vehicles and we are proud of the products that we produce, nonetheless, we are realistic in the fact that some aspects of a vehicle will not satisfy each and every customer. I appreciate that you are unhappy with the feel of the steering and we value the feedback and opinions of all our customers, as we use this to improve the products and services that we provide.

I can advise that there are no current plans at this time to alter the BMW 5 Series for future production, however, there is always a possibility that the situation may change. I have forwarded your feedback to our product development department for future consideration when designing new products. I have also logged your comments under case reference x-xxxxxx, which will be used as part of our ongoing quality auditing programme.

I acknowledge that you have carried out some research on the internet. The web links you have provided, while they are interesting to read, are unregulated sources of information, therefore, they do not always give a reliable representation of a possible situation. Unfortunately, I am unable to comment on the opinions of third party representatives and those of other individuals.

I am sorry that you will remain unhappy with the steering of the new BMW 5 Series, however, I trust that we will be able to restore your faith in our products in the future"

I would love to get the question to the techies in BMW , but they are not going to listen to me, instead you have to go through the normal customer service dept who send out the usual blurb.It needs a well known magazine to have any influence or get through to the right people.
Come on BMW, if its driven by software, it must be configerable, surely?
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      02-28-2012, 05:36 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuvMyE92 View Post
I owned my E39 M5 at the same time that I owned the F10 535.

Now I own only the M5. If I had gotten rid of it when I bought the 535, I probably wouldn't have noticed how bad the steering is, how poorly the engine ran and the annoying often failing i-drive. Since I still had the E39 and drove both, it got to the point that I couldn't stand the 535 and sold it.

Keep your car. It's the best thing BMW ever made.
If you had gotten rid of the e39, then perhaps you would have gotten used to the new feel of the steering, noticed that the engine is running much smoother than atleast a 525i e39 and that the i-drive in reality probably almost never fails, atleast is has never for me so far.
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      02-28-2012, 09:44 AM   #7
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LuvMyE92 - Comparing an M5 to a regular 5 is like comparing apples and oranges, really. You should compare it to the F10 M5. I am surprised to hear about the idrive failures. My idrive is flawless and quick.
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      02-29-2012, 01:31 AM   #8
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I have no E39 to compare with but I can tell you that my 530d xDrive is by far the best car I have had. And I have owned Audis, MB:s, VW:s, Volvos etc...
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      02-29-2012, 05:26 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmernerd
I have no E39 to compare with but I can tell you that my 530d xDrive is by far the best car I have had. And I have owned Audis, MB:s, VW:s, Volvos etc...
Right, but by your own admission you have never driven the beloved e39. Hamburger tastes awesome and the best if you never had steak.

Not saying the F cars are hamburger and the E39 is steak... Oh, heck, yes I am!
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      02-29-2012, 06:13 AM   #10
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it seems I'm not the only person to think the E39 is better than the F10 in some respects!

Latest concern is about the seat height in the F10. Each to their own but it doesn't feel like it goes up as high as he e39. I like to sit up high and the 10 feels a bit on he ow side. Some of that may be because of higher bonnet.
Does it make anydiffence if fully electric seats are specified? (I've only driven the part electric ones to date)
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      02-29-2012, 06:26 AM   #11
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I've got the full comfort seats - electric and they go so high my head is bent against the roof !!
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      02-29-2012, 06:58 AM   #12
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blimey!

I'll see if I can ry one out at a dealership this weekend.
I'm 5'10'' so I'd expect the seat to get my head pretty close to the roof.
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      03-01-2012, 05:51 AM   #13
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eskdale , if you don't mind me asking, how tall are you i referecen to the comfort seats. Don' tell me you are 7foot 8!
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      03-01-2012, 07:28 AM   #14
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Hi AP, I'm 6 foot and the car (M Sport Touring) does have the panoramic sun roof fitted, don't know if that makes some difference to the head room.
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      03-02-2012, 04:39 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWrules7 View Post
Right, but by your own admission you have never driven the beloved e39. Hamburger tastes awesome and the best if you never had steak.

Not saying the F cars are hamburger and the E39 is steak... Oh, heck, yes I am!
Then I think I"ll stick to fresh burgers...I am not into old steaks!
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      03-03-2012, 12:02 PM   #16
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well i popped into a differtn dealership today and despite looking at about 20 5 series they had in, bioth used and new, none had full electric Seats. Despite that i sat in a new 5 and adjusted the seats and found that th adjustment was higher than the other car I had driven. The car I had driven was an early 2010 model so perhaps there has been revision to this ?
Anyway it was perfectly ok. As I say I'm 5'10'' and with the seat up to its highest I had about 2 - 3 inches headroom. This was better and the position I prefer to sit.
So now just getting some quotes from a few dealerships and expect to place the order next weekend. I will of course post pics once it delivered

looking forward to some new gadgets notibly head up display and active cruise control.
I will miss the steering though, i don't care what anyone says, E39 steering is the best! Th E39 really is a true classic
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      03-03-2012, 12:41 PM   #17
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Hi AP, I notice you are going to order the active cruise control. I have the ACC but couldn't find any dealer with it to try it before ordering. The local dealer said that they had never sold one with Active Cruise Control. - If you've tried it - what did you think of it?
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      03-03-2012, 01:26 PM   #18
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I am a former e39 owner, but went through a E63 before getting my F10 (535i Sport Pck). I agree the steering in the E39 is much better, no comparison in fact. But the E63's was much worse than the E39 also. By that I am just stating that BMW moved away from very tactile steering in their bigger models some time ago (my E63 was a 2004). By now we all know that energy savings is affecting all systems on a modern car as 911 owners are complaining about the same thing. I believe we will get back to getting more feedback in our cars, at least the ones from driver oriented companies like BMW, however, we are clearly in that period where the technology is not yet fully there. Hopefully software updates will be able to help us F10 owners, but I think it will take new hardware too.

My 0.2 cents.
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      03-03-2012, 01:27 PM   #19
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When I was choosing the options, I tried to find a demo car with ACC but none of them had it and the dealer told me he hadn't sold any F10/11 with ACC. Looks like most BMW drivers want to be in control

So instead, I spent the money on other features such as VDC and DAB.
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      03-03-2012, 01:28 PM   #20
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I've not tried it either. , same with HUD, I've seen it on stationary car, but not on the move.
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      03-04-2012, 04:56 AM   #21
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Hi AP, I was interested as I've had Active cruise control on my Ford Galaxy for nearly 5 years and that is brilliant. It was one of the reasons for choosing the 5 series. The Ford had the limitation that it was a manual (shift stick) which meant if the speed every dropped below 40 on the flat or 45 on an incline the cruise control would ask you to change gear which would of course trip it out and you would have to re-engage it. So I was looking forward to the F11 with the auto and active cruise control. In my opinion if you are using cruise control its because you want a relaxed drive. If you want to push it you would not use Cruise control. So why as soon as you engage Active cruise does it ignore the settings of Sport, Comfort and Eco Pro and select sport for the gearchanges?

Example you have the cruise set at 70 and are following traffic at 55 mph quite happily in 8th gear. If the car in front leaves the motorway at a exit slip, why does it then drop down a couple of gears and acceralate fast and then slow down again. The Ford will just gently close up the gap. Also if you are travelling at 70 mph and someone overtakes you , when they pull back in front of you the Bimmer slows down to make a sufficient gap. The Ford on the other hand behaves like a typical driver. If someone pulls in front of you and they are accelerating away from you it just keeps a steady speed, if they are not accelerating away from you then it slows down. Much better than the Bimmer and that is 5 yrs old technology. The Ford also has a slightly better range at seeing the vehicles in front and reacts a bit quicker plus it helps it hasn't dropped down a couple of gears and accelerating just to find another car in front and have to slow down.

The Bimmer does have a nice feature that when you indicate to overtake it accelerates. With the Ford you had to either manually accelerate or pull out into the next lane and wait a few seconds before it sees it clear in front then it would accelerate. I got into the habit of pulling out close behind a car that had just passed me and it would then follow that. Do that in the Bimmer and it slows down because you are close to the car in front ahhh!!

One way of improving the relaxed feel of the cruise I found was to use the paddle up shift. This does nothing except keep it in 8th for a while then push the gear shift to Sports/manual and this locks it in 8th which makes for a more relaxed drive when using the cruise control. If you don't have the paddles then when you move it to sports/manual it drops down a gear and you then have to change it back to 8th which puts it into manual, so flicking the paddle up works nicely.

You do of course have the stop and go on the Bimmer but Ive not had a chance to give that a really good test yet (done 2.2k miles). I've been lucky enough to avoid most traffic.

As for the HUD that is very good, very pleased with that. Although I would have liked it a bit higher in my view. Sat in a 6 series with HUD and it was much higher in view.

@Surreybmwdriver I'm very impressed with the DAB but be careful if you have any phone chargers or TomTom plugged in they upset the DAB reception and make it drop out a lot more than it would otherwise - what do you think? I have VDC on the Ford Galaxy and rarely ever use it so didn't bother with it on the Bimmer.
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