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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BMW 5-Series (F10) Forums F10 Pricing, Ordering, and Tracking (and European Delivery) ** Official 2011 F10 5-series ( 535i / 550i ) pricing Announced for U.S. **
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      03-25-2010, 03:22 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocco90 View Post
Why BMW is so 'shy' on introducing the 530d to the US market alone with 535i and 550i. A diesel equivalent will be great for many drivers. I don't get the BMW pricing policy and whole concept of "going green". If they really want to introduce efficient cars to the US market why not having 530d?
Take for example the Gran Turismo - it comes only as 550i - the most expensive version.
They want to push people to buy their most expensive version first rather of trying to sell more efficient vehicles. I actually think that 530d is much better than the 535i and many drivers will prefer it. Perhaps the EU versions are on almost same price.
I don't have the official US specifications in terms of MPG but I took for example the EU models and I made the math from L/km to US liquid gallon for the conversation:

535i - 0-100 km for 6 sec - Urban (11.8 L/100 km ~ 19.93 MPG) Extra Urban 6.6 L ~ 35.64 MPG
530d - 0-100 km for 6.3 sec - Urban (8 L/100 km ~ 29.40 MPG) Extra Urban 5.3 L ~ 44.38 MPG

The bottom line is that 530d is ~ 45% more efficient (urban) for only 0.3 sec difference (0-60).
Correct me if I’m wrong but 44.38 MPG (Extra Urban) and such a great performance they can beat the competition. So why BMW doesn't want to introduce the 530d earlier in the US market?
That's an easy one...because the 335d hasn't sold well at all.
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      03-25-2010, 03:26 PM   #46
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      03-25-2010, 03:55 PM   #47
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Is this a true statement?

Is this a true statement?

"When equipped with the Sport Package, the new BMW 5 Series Sedan includes Adaptive Drive, which encompasses Driving Dynamics Control, Electronic Damper Control, and Active Roll Stabilization."
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      03-25-2010, 04:04 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by oasis3582 View Post
That's an easy one...because the 335d hasn't sold well at all.
That is really a BMW problem. Don't know what the heck they were thinking of bringing that here. Bad call on BMW.

They have a smaller diesel that is used widely in Europe which is the 320d. The Europeans hardly ever buy the 335d model. Too expensive and not great in the mpg department. The only 335d's you really see belong to some private individuals and the rest are undercover police.

Come on BMWUSA bring in the 320d model that would average about 68 mpg and I would buy one of those in a heart beat. BMW makes a wonderful variety of diesel cars too bad we never get to enjoy them on our shores.
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      03-25-2010, 04:26 PM   #49
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Pricing Comparison (not War and Peace)

It's interesting how the US market has such fantastic accessibility, due to our potential for demand which can drive pricing down & availability up. However, in this member's opinion, when compared with other vehicles available on the market today there seems to be a bit of a disconnect between research and reality.

When I say disconnect I mean that numerous other autohaus have seemingly done better(?) statistical analysis in determining what percentage of the target population will be capable & willing to defect from their current brands to become new BMW clients (likely taking a step backward in features & functionalities). But let's be honest, when it comes to factory built machines, these are certainly the market leaders that everyone uses as their benchmark for comparison when it comes to drive experience. And justifiably so. Personally speaking I absolutely love entering the cockpit of mine every single day.

What's driving this phenomenon of pricing and availability for the new 5-series, and making everyone else around the globe feel abused by the excessive profit-taking of their local distributorships, is the brand management costs. While these costs are not publicly disclosed, they are providing returns such that BMW is certainly not planning on scaling back their multi-channel, multi-tiered multi-media blitzkrieg. They've hired the best and the brightest to work on the job of selling more Bimmers, and it seems to be paying off in certain markets.

Huge investments in psychological and sociological research have led them to the conclusion that to skimp on MARCOM will equate to losing momentum and thus share of market. Investors don't like that very much. So once their media kicks in and blasts everyone with the news about product and pricing (and they've got everyones' attention), it's time to start capturing business by offering an attractive entry price for those of us lucky enough to live in the aforementioned "target geographies". What has been a primary driver for BMW ownership thus far? Go figure... driving experience. Road feel, steering, power and weight distribution, solid brakes and the BRAND IMAGE.

But even in the "best markets" (from a consumer perspective) there exists a price modelling conundrum, because there are those among us who insist on finding a "good value" in the lower, more austere models. What it boils down to is that a handful of the models in each line-up provide a greater percentage of the ROMI (return on marketing investment), because BMW has to offer lower end models in order to avoid being made irrelevant to those below a certain income threshold. So making BMW ownership possible to more people, while still maintaining build quality and innovation has been a challenge.

The dis-equilibrium in ROMI is rebalanced at the moment when the vehicles get traded in (generally around 35k to 45k miles). BMW is able to sell the same machine more than once, and can then begin to charge for maintenance (which is a profit center for other competing brands, even when the vehicle first leaves the dealership with zero miles).

BMW is about pure mathematical & predictive economics. Think "Business Intelligence Quant" meets 5th Avenue artisan.

But aren't there other options available to us, with similar or better pricing for more options & newer technologies at a better price point? Don't other manufacturers provide a better cost:benefit ratio in comparison to BMW's Efficient Dynamic concept?

We're to believe that we aren't over-spending on a depreciating asset while millions of unfortunate others around the globe suffer without basic necessities like food, shelter, medical supplies, sanitation, potable water...

Sorry. My bad. Skip that. Don't want to get too existential.

IMHO the concept of Efficient Dynamics is as much about streamlining our thought processes as it is about lowering our aerodynamic coefficient to reduce fossil fuel consumption and greenhouse gas emissions. Those are both noble and impressive, providing us with arguments as we struggle with balancing our options. But the key question yet remains. How many of us are seriously going to spend close to $70k on an automobile that costs close to $2 a mile to operate? As beautiful as they are, and as lovely the performance, driving a LeMans car to work every day simply isn't a cost effective option for many of us (especially those of us with kids who will at some point in the near future be heading to college). Maybe BMW could offer a 1-year MIT, Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Cornell, [fill in school name here] scholarship with every 550 sold... hmmm, there's a thought.

Die-hard Bimmer fans like myself and my wife believe that the 535's and 550's are where they'd like us to keep our minds focused. These gorgeous models are supposed to represent our "Brass Key" so to speak. Their message is that we need to keep our eyes raised, but not so high up that acquiring one seems unrealistic (it's not a Veyron after all). We can never ever think that acquiring these beauties (via attractive lease or purchase plans) represents something being unfair in the grander scheme of life on planet earth.

On a more local level, our salesman wants us to start looking at the 7-series. Is that so we can build up our expectation and budget for a 750iL, and then compromise by settling for the less expensive (read: less guilt inducing) 550? Time will tell.

So I titled this Pricing Comparison because we've recently retired our XC90 after a close to 100k miles and are now on the hunt for our next family mileage maker. Our 2010 335i (sport, comfort, premium, nav, etc etc etc), is getting way too many miles put on it so we're looking for a used 5-series wagon. Does anyone have one for sale that's in good shape, or know of onein your neck of the woods that we can take a look at? We're in the Tampa-metro area. Thanks in advance...

Cheers, AB
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      03-25-2010, 04:38 PM   #50
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Based on the ordering guide and pricing that came out today, I threw together a quick spreadsheet to calculate MSRP pricing for the 2011 535i and 550i. I assumed the European Delivery price to be 7% less than the US MSRP since I haven't seen that info as of yet.

To calculate a price, just enter a 1 or 0 next to each option in the option column, enter your tax rate, loan term in months, loan rate in APR, down payment amount, discount from MSRP, and you will get your monthly payment. The gray cells at the bottom are where you enter these values other than the options column.

I didn't build in the rules as stated in the ordering guide for which options must be ordered with other options, so refer to that when adding options to make sure your build is a valid BMW configuration.

Also, when you select a package, the corresponding stand alone options will be highlighted in gray so you know which options are left to choose and which are already included in a package so you don't double pick and artificially increase the price. Once again, no formulas to prevent this, so use common sense.

The spreadsheet is protected to prevent accidental changing of cells. To modify protected cells, just unprotect the worksheet. There is no password required to do so.

I just uploaded a new version that is protected properly as the first one was not setup correctly.

I am personally having trouble downloading with Internet Explorer, but it works fine when downloading with Firefox.
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      03-25-2010, 05:12 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agni View Post
Can someone post or PM me wholesale price list plz.
Me too please..... I'd like to get one on order
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      03-25-2010, 05:47 PM   #52
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Smile bye bye 3 & 5

So; up for sale is a 2003 540i and a 2004 M3 Cab.w/aluminum top. Both have an extra set of winter Blizzaks and wheels. All my BMW's are Silver so I guess the new "550" will be too. What do you think the off list discount will be in the first 6 months?
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      03-25-2010, 07:38 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoehne View Post
Based on the ordering guide and pricing that came out today, I threw together a quick spreadsheet to calculate MSRP pricing for the 2011 535i and 550i. I assumed the European Delivery price to be 7% less than the US MSRP since I haven't seen that info as of yet.
Great! ....now could you create a spreadsheet that calculates wholesale invoice?
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      03-25-2010, 08:52 PM   #54
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IMO your rationale is perfectly sane, but what we need to consider is the missing element(s) in the model you built -- namely, Interest Group Involvement.

Who stands to benefit most from a high consumption vehicle? Who would lose revenue (and thus, profits) by having many more high efficiency autos on our highways and byways? You guessed it, the Oil & Gas Industry. George Bush & Co., Cheney and Friends, yada yada yada.

Think of it like this... if there is a perceived "lack of resource" then gas and oil pricing can continue to steadily escalate, even though there is really no shortage at all. Speculation (futures trading) and profit motive (mutual funds, retirement funds, etc) will be sufficient to influence or drive pricing up through $100 per barrel, and keep it there permanently.

(** On a side note, has anyone else been stupefied by the fact that the price per barrel being propagated by the news outlets actually has no link whatsoever with the real volume of crude being stored by the US Gov't? Reserves are always being quoted as though they have some input into why our price per gallon keeps going up over $3. It's really just smoke and mirrors. Do some research on it and you'll be shocked to know that we're all just being manipulated by false information, squeezed like oranges for every drop... don't let me get started... **).

If we reduce our consumption by getting 45mpg or 68mpg or whatever it is that's better than the ~18mpg we average with most vehicles on the road today, we'll demand considerably less volume on an annualized basis. The energy companies will lose what's known as "asset velocity" on their installations (pipelines, etc). A consequence will be that they will lose profit margins and the life-cycles of those massive drilling & refining platforms will need to be extended further. This in turn will dramatically slow the rate of technological innovation in that sector. Then, the Analysts start to lose interest because "news sells", so energy stock prices wane, and the handful of people at the top who own everything fail to make as much money as they promised their investors. So they lose credibility. That makes them somewhat ornery, and we don't want to be around them when they get ornery.

What we get as a result of people not wanting these barons to get ornery is the hiring of a small army of lobbyists who camp out on Capitol Hill. They wine and dine, slowly chiseling away at the best intentions of our elected officials. Politicians are offered either carrots (donations, parks for their communities, baseball diamonds for the kids in their districts, etc) or sticks (scandals, hired hookers, bad press and you can imagine the worse for yourselves). Come heck or high water these guys force our politicians to see "the way" of the handful of the richest.

This is how it has always been, and it will continue to be this way until we as a nation, as a country of American men and women, stand up and be heard.

Until that time comes, it'll be business as usual. The executives who run major auto companies like BMW and Audi and MB who want to sell into our US market, as well as our domestic producers like GM, Ford, Chrysler in the US, they're all influenced by these rich and powerful amigos from prep school and college. These guys all grew up together, or went to school together, or belong to the same fraternal organization(s). You want a deal done, just pick up the phone a ask for help. As long as you play ball by "the rules", you can eat as many of the hot dogs as you want.

Our very nice chat board here, for all our best intents and purposes, is still merely a "pimple on the @ss of progress" as they say (please pardon my French).

And that my friends, is why we won't see the most efficient models here in the US any time soon. Your option of course, if you so chose to do so, is to fly over to get one in Germany. Simply pay the ~$2,500 for the conversion to US standards (which doesn't include the inspections & certs), take a trip around Europe for a month or so, and then drive it to Bremen for delivery to Boston, NY, Miami or wherever your nearest port of call might be at a cost of approximately $800.

It's a lot more work, and maintenance on it will be on your own dime (read: expensive), but at least you'll be able to enjoy the economy on a tank-by-tank basis. You may suffer from sticker shock at each service interval though, as parts may need to be flown in from Bavaria. But hey, you'll have bucked the system in some small way. Who knows what your resale value might be, but that's a topic for another posting...



Cheers, AB


Quote:
Originally Posted by rocco90 View Post
Why BMW is so 'shy' on introducing the 530d to the US market alone with 535i and 550i. A diesel equivalent will be great for many drivers. I don't get the BMW pricing policy and whole concept of "going green". If they really want to introduce efficient cars to the US market why not having 530d?
Take for example the Gran Turismo - it comes only as 550i - the most expensive version.
They want to push people to buy their most expensive version first rather of trying to sell more efficient vehicles. I actually think that 530d is much better than the 535i and many drivers will prefer it. Perhaps the EU versions are on almost same price.
I don't have the official US specifications in terms of MPG but I took for example the EU models and I made the math from L/km to US liquid gallon for the conversation:

535i - 0-100 km for 6 sec - Urban (11.8 L/100 km ~ 19.93 MPG) Extra Urban 6.6 L ~ 35.64 MPG
530d - 0-100 km for 6.3 sec - Urban (8 L/100 km ~ 29.40 MPG) Extra Urban 5.3 L ~ 44.38 MPG

The bottom line is that 530d is ~ 45% more efficient (urban) for only 0.3 sec difference (0-60).
Correct me if I’m wrong but 44.38 MPG (Extra Urban) and such a great performance they can beat the competition. So why BMW doesn't want to introduce the 530d earlier in the US market?

Last edited by bmw_speeder_2010; 03-25-2010 at 09:00 PM..
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      03-25-2010, 08:56 PM   #55
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550xi???

I saw "550xi" above, is that true, we can get the 550 with xDrive???
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      03-25-2010, 08:59 PM   #56
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PM me invoice details and I will put them into the spreadsheet

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichReg View Post
Great! ....now could you create a spreadsheet that calculates wholesale invoice?
No problem, PM me the invoice info and I can add it in. If I get bored tomorrow, I will try to build in some rules so the configuration is more idiot proof.
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      03-25-2010, 09:03 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by hoehne View Post
No problem, PM me the invoice info and I can add it in. If I get bored tomorrow, I will try to build in some rules so the configuration is more idiot proof.
Hey, nice spreadsheet. Maybe others had the same thing, but I needed to unprotect the worksheet in order to be able to add or remove options (i.e. change the column value from a 0 to a 1 or visa versa).

Sweet, appreciate you doing that for us. Either way we cut it it'll still be a cool $1k per month for either vehicle, give or take $50...
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      03-26-2010, 12:08 AM   #58
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Like everyone else, if you PM me the ED/wholesale cost, i would be very grateful
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      03-26-2010, 03:18 AM   #59
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Guys, be patient! The pricing is out for 24 hours, no one has seen an official price sheet yet and you are screaming for wholesale pricing.
From my experience it will be pretty much inpossible to get even remotely close to invoice with a brand new model. It has always been that if you want the newest, hottest thing, you end up paying for it. Sticker. This does not only apply to cars.... Anyone ever had a NEO GEO?
Remember: If you don't buy it - someone else will....

Other than that I am so happy they released pricing and btw: the car is awesome. Only moved it a few hundred yards, but still...
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      03-26-2010, 05:06 AM   #60
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For us in Germany it is really a very low price for the 535i:


$ 50,475 in USA

=

€ 37.950,- (at the current rate of exchange) versus € 50.300,- price in Germany


Also the indiviudial packages are mostly the half price ...


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      03-26-2010, 07:07 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw_speeder_2010 View Post
This is how it has always been, and it will continue to be this way until we as a nation, as a country of American men and women, stand up and be heard.
Cheers, AB
If you remove the impossible, what is left must be the answer. Perhaps we should consider that government already reflects “our” values. We live beyond our means via credit and we are willing to go along with unrealistic bubbles (Tech, Housing..) if it generates disposable income even if it is not in our best long term interests. We grew on the backs of cheap energy from limited resources and continue to consume those resources at an ever increasing pace. From a purely operations standpoint none of this makes sense.

It would seem as though we are going to have to hit a very large hard wall before we figure out that this approach really is not viable. Simply heading towards the wall at a very high speed only to be caught by a net (near financial meltdown last year) does not seem to be enough to do the job. We are actually going to have to hit the wall and cull the population before reality will sink in.

I am not advocating hitting walls. I was simply raised by a dust bowl Oklahoman who instilled the fear of depression in me from a very young age. I’ve not lived through bad but I have enough of a taste of it to know I do not want to.
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      03-26-2010, 11:52 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lolachampcar View Post
If you remove the impossible, what is left must be the answer. Perhaps we should consider that government already reflects “our” values. We live beyond our means via credit and we are willing to go along with unrealistic bubbles (Tech, Housing..) if it generates disposable income even if it is not in our best long term interests. We grew on the backs of cheap energy from limited resources and continue to consume those resources at an ever increasing pace. From a purely operations standpoint none of this makes sense.

It would seem as though we are going to have to hit a very large hard wall before we figure out that this approach really is not viable. Simply heading towards the wall at a very high speed only to be caught by a net (near financial meltdown last year) does not seem to be enough to do the job. We are actually going to have to hit the wall and cull the population before reality will sink in.

I am not advocating hitting walls. I was simply raised by a dust bowl Oklahoman who instilled the fear of depression in me from a very young age. I’ve not lived through bad but I have enough of a taste of it to know I do not want to.
I like your thought process. Rings so true, unfortunately. We are not rationale beings.

Yet these are still superb machines, and IMO worth every Pfennig. Personally I'm just going to have to draw the line at what's satisfying enough for my sensory stimulation versus what's truly splurging.

Have a great weekend! Cheers, AB
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      03-27-2010, 04:11 PM   #63
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US pricing is out!!

535i base price is $49,600
550i base price is $59,700

These are around $1000-$1500 lower than 2010.

Most options are priced the same as the 550i GT.
The dynamic handling package is $2700 on both models
The Premium package 1 is $1800 on the 535i and std. on the 550i
The premium package 2 is $4900 on the 535i and $2800 on the 550i
The sport package is $2200 on both models

For 36 month leases, the residuals are 58% for the 535i and 54% for the 550i.
Money factors are .00250 for the 535i and .00230 for the 550i.

I'll post the pricing printout in full on Monday when I have access to a scanner.
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      03-28-2010, 10:11 PM   #64
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Official March 26, 2010 pricing

The official pricing sheet was released on Saturday, March 26, 2010. This complete sheet included all of the option combination pricing for options that are included in multiple packages and therefore is more informative than the pricing released until now.

I updated my spreadsheet and included it with these new prices. The European Delivery price is still listed as N/A and therefore I have assumed a 7% discount from the US MSRP for this number in my spreadsheet. The sheet is protected to prevent changing of cells, but can be unprotected as there is no password required.

I have had trouble downloading with Internet Explorer myself, but found the Firefox works fine. The spreadsheet was created in Excel 2007.

Added price sheet
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File Type: pdf 5 series price sheet March 26 2010.pdf (579.8 KB, 482 views)
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File Type: zip F10_Pricing.zip (15.9 KB, 371 views)
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Last edited by mrh335; 03-29-2010 at 09:04 AM..
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      03-29-2010, 12:18 AM   #65
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This is awesome!! May I suggest adding columns for Estimated Invoice:

Estimated US Base Invoice: =ROUND(0.92*C2/5,0)*5
Estimated Options Invoice: =ROUND(0.91*C6/5,0)*5

These estimates are based on previous year's invoice prices.

So, for example, you should get these Estimated Invoice Prices for the 550i:
Base: $54,925
ZCV: $1,545
ZP2: $2,185
ZCW: $955
ZDH: $2,455
ZSP: $2,000
Note again that these are Estimates only.

Last edited by masku; 03-29-2010 at 12:23 AM.. Reason: Added Example
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      03-29-2010, 01:14 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by masku View Post
This is awesome!! May I suggest adding columns for Estimated Invoice:

Estimated US Base Invoice: =ROUND(0.92*C2/5,0)*5
Estimated Options Invoice: =ROUND(0.91*C6/5,0)*5

These estimates are based on previous year's invoice prices.

So, for example, you should get these Estimated Invoice Prices for the 550i:
Base: $54,925
ZCV: $1,545
ZP2: $2,185
ZCW: $955
ZDH: $2,455
ZSP: $2,000
Note again that these are Estimates only.
I've done exactly that with the spreadsheet posted here. I compared some of the known invoice values (e.g. Metallic Paint) and they seem accurate.
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