[vladman]

Hi,

The car's just had its regular service, and the dealership (BMW) advised me both front discs and brake pads need changing. They said the pads are at 2mm and discs are at "minimum limit". They quoted £600 to do both, parts and labour.

This seems like a lot to me, and the car is out of warranty, so I'm thinking about either doing it myself, or having an independent do it.

I'm in London (just west of it actually), so any recommendation for good local indies and approximate costs would be very much appreciated.

Also, I wouldn't mind doing the job myself if not too complicated. I've done it before on other cars and motorbikes. Are there some good guides out there?

What annoys me the most about this is that the iDrive seems so inaccurate when it comes to reporting what mileage is left in pads. My fronts have been saying 10000 miles left for months and months (possibly longer than 8-9 months), and I do approximately 1000-1200 miles a month. It's still saying 10000 miles, even though the dealer said there's 2mm left on them and they need changing. I don't think I've yet had the "secondary" warning, when the sensors get in touch with the disc. Is this what I should expect, does this warning come up on the dash? After this warning, there's still supposedly some life left in the pads, although they should then ideally be changed ASAP?

If I went the route of doing it myself, are there recommended (online or physical) shops to source these parts?

Many thanks!

Vlad.

[BMW Steve]

Although I would do it my self if it were me, if you factor in the cost of parts from eurocarparts and break ware sensor's you can get a local garage to do that at half the price or even less if you supplied the parts. The discs are not cheep ATE Brake Disc (Front) £120ish each before discount, pads almost £50 and a ware sensor £10 to £15.

Doing this your self has a bonus factor, you can give the area a clean while the wheel is off and the discs/pads are being swapped over, all a garage will do is swap the parts over,,,,

[vladman]

Originally Posted by BMW Steve

Although I would do it my self if it were me, if you factor in the cost of parts from eurocarparts and break ware sensor's you can get a local garage to do that at half the price or even less if you supplied the parts. The discs are not cheep ATE Brake Disc (Front) £120ish each before discount, pads almost £50 and a ware sensor £10 to £15.

Doing this your self has a bonus factor, you can give the area a clean while the wheel is off and the discs/pads are being swapped over, all a garage will do is swap the parts over,,,,

Thank you BMW Steve.

So I went to the Eurocarparts website to have a look. They sell these ATE discs you mention, and also Brembo and Zimmerman (these being significantly cheaper, but out of stock - does anyone have any experience with them, are they ok). The pads are like you say about £50 and I'm assuming that's the price for the kit (4 pads) as that's what's shown on the picture. The wear sensors are about £10, but I don't know if I need one (if it's a kit), or two of these.

So this works out to about £320 (less if I went for those Zimmerman discs, whenever they might get them in stock).

To get an idea, I then went to ClickMechanic (any opinion of them on this forum? I've never used them, a friend has, and has been happy with their work), and they quote £455 for the parts and labour.

Are there other good online shops where I could go to check the price of parts (against eurocarparts)?

Again, if anyone's able to recommend either online shops and/or local indies (west London), I'd be really grateful.

Ok, just googled some local indies to me, and found these two, does anyone have any opinion/experience of them? They seem reasonably well rated:

• Harrow Service Centre
• Motologic

Many thanks!

P.S. Do I need any special tools to do the job myself? I have a decent set of tools already, but probably don't have any specialist bits (if they're needed).

[vladman]

Just had a look on ebay. Wow, so much choice.

There is a complete set (brand APEC? discs, pads and wear sensor) for £139. Too cheap to be any good?

Then, there's a complete ATE set (again discs, pads and wear sensor) for £202.

Finally, there's a complete apparently genuine BMW set for £333.

There's even the same stuff eurocarparts sells on their website, but for less money...

How do I decide what to get??

Clearly, I want to spend as little as possible, but at the same time, not end up fitting rubbish to my car that's not going to last or will give me problems, warp, etc....

[BMW Steve]

I replaced my GT front discs with Brembo, will do the same when it comes to replacing the F11 discs n pads

[warmshed]

I used EBC and am very pleased with them, there is a delay on the discs at the moment but give them a ring, I used their standard OEM ultimax2 pads.
Have them on my 520 and wife'sAudi TT, lowdust too, Unless you have damaged them you should be able to re-use your wear sensor.
Highly regarded on motorcycles.

http://ebcbrakes.com/

[vladman]

If anyone here has done this work themselves, could you let me know if you need any specialist tools, or can you get the work done with a standard set of tools?

Any tips, anything in particular quite tricky to do, or anything to watch out for?

I'm leaning towards getting a kit of ATE discs and pads off ebay (shipped from Germany, £202 including shipping), as these seem priced somewhere in the middle between the genuine BMW kit (£333), and the cheapest options, which I'm a bit wary of (£139 - APEC?).

Also, do you guys have any opinion or experience with Zimmerman discs? I found some threads on American BMW forums where they're generally well regarded, and a few people say they're the same as BMW OEM, but OEM ones wear the BMW logo and are for that reason more expensive. Eurocarparts sells a pair of these for about £150 and they're in stock in my local store. Then I'd need to pair them with some pads... ATE, EBC... Hmmm....

Many thanks!

[Bazn]

Euro Car Parts are regularly offering 20-30% discounts in flash sales at the moment, I picked up Brembo discs/pads all round for my 520 AND our Antara for just over £600. Will get the father in law to help with fitting and save a huge wedge of cash.

Vauxhall wanted £2k to supply/fit brakes all round BMW wanted £1500 so I'm happy with a saving of circa £3k!! Still can't get over what Vauxhall wanted to charge though - makes you mad that they will get away with charging that to people who can't/don't look elsewhere...

[warmshed]

You will need a brake caliper piston rewind tool, I bought a cheap set that worked a treat

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-...EAAOSwUdlWcna5

Of course make sure you use axle stands don't work from just a jack. Other than that just a bit of common sense and a torque wrench.

There is a step by step guide with pictures here http://f10.5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1266532

[vladman]

Originally Posted by warmshed

You will need a brake caliper piston rewind tool, I bought a cheap set that worked a treat...

Thank you warmshed!

[spirocheter]

I have had terrible issues with non genuine BMW brakes. I am still running my 2008 335d, which I had under extended warranty. The price I was quoted by BMW for replacement of discs and pads (I can't remember the figure) seemed excessive and I opted to buy from Eurocarparts, the most expensive Pagid discs, and Pagid pads (front and rear). I bought sensors for brake pad wear from EBay.

I had a local trusted mechanic fit them and within only 2k miles, and gentle driving (I'd driven my previous car far far harder), not applying brakes etc when warm, they had warped, not by a huge amount, but the juddering was very noticeable even from speeds of around 50 with light braking. I was told by my mechanic, the manufacture of Pagid had been moved to China and the carbon content of the steel was of much poorer quality.

I tried to get Brembo, but my mechanic was having difficulty obtaining them, and he recommended Honeywell discs and Bosch pads (in stock with his supplier), so I went with these. Again, exactly the same problem, not quite as severe. He assured me there were no other mechanical issues. Another set of warped brakes. Not as severe as before, but still too bad to live with with wear on suspension components etc.

I then took my car to a BMW specialist, who is very highly regarded. I asked him to check the hub faces were not out of alignment etc and he checked everything very carefully. He advised Bosch discs and Bosch pads, sounded OK to me, all German (just changed the front discs). Now these have been the best yet, but if braking quite firmly from, let's say 70mph, there is still a very slight judder. I should say I've not changed the rear brakes since switching to the Pagid. It is acceptable now but slightly annoying at times.

The whole experience took me close to selling the car. I will never spec any brakes other than genuine again. I notice there is an EBay seller presently in Germany selling genuine BMW brakes (I was looking this up before buying my F11, which I'm due to collect tomorrow)!

Yes, they are more expensive, but will potentially save enormous hassle and significant performance issues. I should mention, I had a local garage replace my e46 330d brakes years back, not even thinking about the potential issue of problems, and they squealed like pigs. I traded the car because of this! This is why I had extensively, I thought, researched the issue of which discs and pads to go with on forums etc before I bought for the 335d!

Buy genuine!

[The Beast]

Originally Posted by spirocheter

I have had terrible issues with non genuine BMW brakes. I am still running my 2008 335d, which I had under extended warranty. The price I was quoted by BMW for replacement of discs and pads (I can't remember the figure) seemed excessive and I opted to buy from Eurocarparts, the most expensive Pagid discs, and Pagid pads (front and rear). I bought sensors for brake pad wear from EBay.

I had a local trusted mechanic fit them and within only 2k miles, and gentle driving (I'd driven my previous car far far harder), not applying brakes etc when warm, they had warped, not by a huge amount, but the juddering was very noticeable even from speeds of around 50 with light braking. I was told by my mechanic, the manufacture of Pagid had been moved to China and the carbon content of the steel was of much poorer quality.

I tried to get Brembo, but my mechanic was having difficulty obtaining them, and he recommended Honeywell discs and Bosch pads (in stock with his supplier), so I went with these. Again, exactly the same problem, not quite as severe. He assured me there were no other mechanical issues. Another set of warped brakes. Not as severe as before, but still too bad to live with with wear on suspension components etc.

I then took my car to a BMW specialist, who is very highly regarded. I asked him to check the hub faces were not out of alignment etc and he checked everything very carefully. He advised Bosch discs and Bosch pads, sounded OK to me, all German (just changed the front discs). Now these have been the best yet, but if braking quite firmly from, let's say 70mph, there is still a very slight judder. I should say I've not changed the rear brakes since switching to the Pagid. It is acceptable now but slightly annoying at times.

The whole experience took me close to selling the car. I will never spec any brakes other than genuine again. I notice there is an EBay seller presently in Germany selling genuine BMW brakes (I was looking this up before buying my F11, which I'm due to collect tomorrow)!

Yes, they are more expensive, but will potentially save enormous hassle and significant performance issues. I should mention, I had a local garage replace my e46 330d brakes years back, not even thinking about the potential issue of problems, and they squealed like pigs. I traded the car because of this! This is why I had extensively, I thought, researched the issue of which discs eand pads to go with on forums etc before I bought for the 335d!

Buy genuine!

I had exactly the same issues with Eurocar Parts pads and disks on an E46 325i, they squealed and then warped (I do drive my cars hard though). My father in law fitted them and I helped him do it so I now they were fitted correctly. Only bought genuine since...

[warmshed]

check out the EBC website

[shiner]

I'd caution anyone who has their car under warranty to get them done by BMW to maintain said warranty and goodwill when in the year or two out of the warranty. I am sure BMW will look more favorably on a car that they know they have looked after. Of course, that's less important if years out of warranty.

[vladman]

So, I've finally had a chance to take a wheel off and have a look.

Typical dealer cr@p. They said the pads were at 2mm, there's about 5mm left in fact.

The discs are worn though and there's a distinct lip, but other than that, look good, smooth and uniform. How do you decide when they're TOO worn, and should be replaced? I'm tempted to keep on driving, as there's quite a bit of pad material left, but not sure how to know when the discs really need replacing.

On another note, can worn discs be a reason for MOT failure?

See pics:

Outer:



Inner:

[warmshed]

Not a MOT failure unless down to the metal. They don't check them just their performance. Looks like you have got a while before needing them to be replaced, as long as you have checked all 4 front pads. Plenty of time to get the parts for when you do. If the lip is not too bad you can re use the discs, just change the pads
.
There should be an official wear limit, easy to measure if you have access to a micrometer. o

[suj999]

Your pads are fine for few more months. But change is within 1000 miles if you want to keep the sensor.

Measurements, by micrometer. Very cheap on eBay.
£6 or so, worth getting at those prices.
http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/Engineers-0-.../381374211041?

Zimmerman discs are fine on the f10,
Get it from www.carparts4less.co.uk same company as euro car parts. Sign up to their email and they will send you 10% voucher within a month. £60 each before discount. ATE one will probably last bit better, not sure if it's worth paying double.

Pads, pagid will do. I have even tried the Mayle one that's about £25 for a set, seemed fine.

Don't worry about all this genuine nonsenses on pads.

If you need sensor, check this guy's items. http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-Genuine-.../282158365299?
He will have it for £10.

Fitter, can recommend someone in East London, don't know anyone in West.

[vladman]

Thank you warmshed and suj999.

Warmshed, where did you get those numbers from, especially the measurements for when the discs need changing, are they official?

suj999, I've bitten the bullet, and already ordered the genuine set of discs and pads and sensor from Germany... Most expensive of all, but as much as I was tempted by the cheaper options, on my previous car, when I fitted them (the cheaper stuff), I always had issues... So I thought it was worth it, especially as in the near future, I'll stop putting as many miles on the car as I am now, so they should really last.

The only thing now is the MOT, which I have to get done in the next 10 days (that's why I ordered everything now). I think I'll take it in as is, and hope they don't fail it, but if they do, I'll have the parts to replace.

Thanks for the links, but I think that micrometer is too small to measure the front discs? As they're 36mm when new, but the micrometer only goes to 25mm? I'll look for a bigger one...

Thanks guys.

[warmshed]

25-50 Moore and Wrights, (v.good make)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/25-50-micr...8AAOSwaB5XwuWf

[suj999]

These are the hr sizes I got for my F10 520d,

position: Front Axle construction: Vented , Ø: 330,0 mm , thickness: 24,0 mm , tot. height: 66,0 mm , qty. wheel bolts: 5 ,
Min. Thickness: 22,5 mm , Ø hub: 75,0 mm , pitch circle Ø: 120,0 mm Alternative


Brake Disc
position: Rear Axle construction: Vented , Ø: 330,0 mm , thickness: 20,0 mm , tot. height: 69,0 mm , qty. wheel bolts: 5 ,
Min. Thickness: 18,5 mm , Ø hub: 75,0 mm , pitch circle Ø: 120,0 mm Alternative

And measured them with this.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Outside-Ex.../111791247375?

[warmshed]

Originally Posted by suj999

These are the hr sizes I got for my F10 520d,

position: Front Axle construction: Vented , Ø: 330,0 mm , thickness: 24,0 mm , tot. height: 66,0 mm , qty. wheel bolts: 5 ,
Min. Thickness: 22,5 mm , Ø hub: 75,0 mm , pitch circle Ø: 120,0 mm Alternative


Brake Disc
position: Rear Axle construction: Vented , Ø: 330,0 mm , thickness: 20,0 mm , tot. height: 69,0 mm , qty. wheel bolts: 5 ,
Min. Thickness: 18,5 mm , Ø hub: 75,0 mm , pitch circle Ø: 120,0 mm Alternative

And measured them with this.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Outside-Ex.../111791247375?

My appologies that I listed the incorrect disc thickness, I will amend post so as not to confuse any future reader. I went out and checked my discs and can confirm they are less than 25 mm. as mine are not new their actual measurement is of no relevance. Are the figures you have for new BMW parts or pattern ones?

BMW always used to stamp minimum thickness on their discs somewhere on the top hat section of the disc. Their normal wear limit used to be 1.6mm

[suj999]

These are for Zimmerman OE spec ones, so BMW ones should be identical.