[C5 FOR]

Recently took delivery of my new F11 520d M Sport in Sophisto Grey and wanted to give some comparisons to my previous 2011 F11 which was also a 2.0d M Sport but in Alpine White.

So, firstly a short summary of specs and previous ownerships.

2008 – 2011 E61 525i M Sport in Le Mans Blue with 19” 172M’s. (I still miss this car so much!!)

2011 – 2014 Alpine White model had the N47 engine and was fairly decently spec’d. I put the OEM black grilles on it and also taped the chrome indicator surrounds. (didn’t spec the ambient ltg so there was no need to worry about the chrome strips on the door handles!). De badged. Kept the standard 19” 351M’s. So with the exception of the alloys it was a black and white car (or should that be white and black??). Eight Speed Sports auto transmission.

Current model has the new B47 engine version (more of which later), manual gearbox (more of which later), Matt Aluminium exterior trim and roof rails, M Sport Plus package (Harmon/Karmon, SPG, and the 19” 351’s) Pano sun roof, LED adaptive headlights, ambient ltg, Pro Sat Nav, the MFIP as i call it (Multi Function Instrument Panel), VDC and the always lovely Grey Shade band. In keeping with the chrome feel i stuck the kidney grilles from the Modern Touring on it as well. Chose a set of 20” 464M’s for her as I was desperate for the mixed wheel look and something a little more distinctive overall.

The main difference or change I wanted to make was to get as far away from an automatic gearbox as fast as I could. The auto gearbox made me a lazy driver and the longer it went on the more “disconnected“ I felt from the car. Specifying the manual box was the easiest decision i was ever going to make and it has been more than worth it. On taking delivery and driving away the driving sensation was immediately back, I could feel the car, the biting point, the ability to flip the throttle, the driving vibration through the clutch pedal and just the overall sense of being in charge of that throttle again without some piece of software making decisions for you. On the previous F11, I used the paddles a handful of times in 3 years and whilst they are good on roads where you don’t have to turn the wheel and can keep your fingers on the paddles continuously as soon as the wheel needs to do a 90 deg plus turn, you don’t have control of the gears any longer. Would appreciate your feedback on this point, yes there’s a case to be made that you make the gear changes before turning into the corner, hence no need to make a shift up (or down) when you are in the corner, I just felt that the shifts between the gears were quite short and needed to be made more quickly as you were exiting a corner and crucially before the wheel was back to less than the 90deg and then having to get your fingers back on the paddles again..........

The improved engine is an exceptional piece of engineering. The previous N47 as I have stated before (not on this forum) was like starting a cold tractor and despite all of its good points (torque, /power ratios) I never quite got away from the farmer in the morning carry on. This new B47 has been dramatically improved, not just with its cold start “noise” which has been improved beyond measure, but i’m sure i can hear it purr when in any mode above Eco Pro. I don’t feel a tremendous difference for the increased lower end torque/power output over the old version but the refinement is undeniable.

LED Adaptive Headlights/High Beam Assistant – WOW!!! what a package this is. I must admit my first reason for specifying this was for its looks, the eyebrow indicator light and the goddam mean sporty look of the headlights themselves with the distinctive flattened corona rings and the LED light display split across the centre of each of the 4 rings. I realised from the start after some research there was a lot more to this package that its good looks. There’s a BMW video on YouTube of their operational aspects and it is just awesome. Are they better than the Visibility Package/Bi Xenons on the old F11, yes would be my opinion all day long. They do take some getting used to at night, when you push the High Beam Assistant to “on” and there’s a car coming towards you, your first instinct is to switch it off as the headlights are still on full beam, but only after a while do you realise no–one is flashing back at you to put the high beam down, the adaptive tech is doing all the work (the video explains how it works).

VDC – specified this time round as I was putting the 20” 464M’s on the car, the previous model was the standard M Sport suspension. I see a noticeable improved difference in the ride across all settings but overall when I look at the car I think it sits higher than the M Sport suspension model particularly at the front. The gap from the top edge of the wheel to the wheel arch is more than i recall. I see there has been some debate on this and wondered if there was a definitive answer? Seems that the M Sport suspension is deleted when you spec the VDC and that is making the difference???? Overall tho, I think having the VDC is needed with the rims I chose. I’m not planning a “drop” at all.

MFIP – quite simply put, a marvellous piece of tech. From the “flashing lights” to advise gear changes in “sports” mode to the vastly improved “Eco Pro” screen, this piece of kit just keeps giving and giving. The Sat Nav aspect display improvement on their is sublime and so much easier to follow than what wasn’t a bad version before. I thought the full black panel display on the previous version was excellent but this tops it 10 fold. Where this tech takes us in the future is something I’m really looking forward too. Will we be able to customise our own displays and colours within the required parameters of what needs to be shown on it – who knows how far this could go!!!

In summary, a vastly improved car from the previous model, the engine refinements, interior spec improvements, headlights and that manual gearbox have made me one happy Han Solo.

So there you have it, hopefully some good feedback for you and now may I present my new Falcon (via some rather poor iPhone camera pics)

[makkan00]

Thanks for writing this comparison.
Enjoyed reading it.

Love LED lights and when I saw them first time

Just wondering why bmw left the windows trim in silver if its M sport car?

[valbmw]

Thank you for the fantastic review!

The reason for manual transmission is perfectly explained. However the manual gearbox is fine until the car has stuck in 3-hour traffic, you know. Wish you will have your way always clear.

I took my car before Adaptive LED option. The Adaptive LEDs are smart like hell and I love it, but the price of retrofitting is just impossible. LEDs is the first thing to check with the next car.

Do you have also the Driver Assist Package? HUD etc.

The Dynamic Handling Package (DHP) that includes Active Roll and Variable Dampers (ARS, VDC) does delete M Sport suspension. Car can be easily lowered on sport springs, because the strut provides (variable) stiffness while the spring provides height and vertical travel. When lowered, the Comfort mode became just one-click "shorter" due to the shorter travel, but still Comfort and Sport are noticeable different. Hopefully you say you won't lower it.

Wish you to enjoy your great new ride!

[valbmw]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Just wondering why bmw left the windows trim in silver if its M sport car?

The black trims is a good thing, however with BMW it is always something separate and called "option 760 BMW Individual high-gloss Shadow Line". And then it's not all, the fender light trims and kidney grills are still left to get blacked out for more money.

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by valbmw

The black trims is a good thing, however with BMW it is always something separate and called "option 760 BMW Individual high-gloss Shadow Line". And then it's not all, the fender light trims and kidney grills are still left to get blacked out for more money.

Thanks. So does bmw charge to have black fender light trim as well?

[valbmw]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Thanks. So does bmw charge to have black fender light trim as well?

They just don't know about it. The glossy black grills are taken from M Performance: http://realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?...51&fg=95&hl=35 while the fender trims are not a part of it. Firstly I've got ones from ebay but they were matte and of softer plastic than the OEMs. Then I did like everybody else: ordered the OEM ones to be wrapped in gloss black. Done.

[remmib]

Originally Posted by valbmw

Thank you for the fantastic review!

The reason for manual transmission is perfectly explained. However the manual gearbox is fine until the car has stuck in 3-hour traffic, you know. Wish you will have your way always clear.

I took my car before Adaptive LED option. The Adaptive LEDs are smart like hell and I love it, but the price of retrofitting is just impossible. LEDs is the first thing to check with the next car.

Do you have also the Driver Assist Package? HUD etc.

The Dynamic Handling Package (DHP) that includes Active Roll and Variable Dampers (ARS, VDC) does delete M Sport suspension. Car can be easily lowered on sport springs, because the strut provides (variable) stiffness while the spring provides height and vertical travel. When lowered, the Comfort mode became just one-click "shorter" due to the shorter travel, but still Comfort and Sport are noticeable different. Hopefully you say you won't lower it.

Wish you to enjoy your great new ride!

This car does not have the DHP, only the VDC since this is a 520d. DHP can only by speced on 530, 535 and 550. But you're right, both those suspensions will delete the m-sport suspension.

[valbmw]

Originally Posted by remmib

This car does not have the DHP, only the VDC since this is a 520d. DHP can only by speced on 530, 535 and 550. But you're right, both those suspensions will delete the m-sport suspension.

I didn't know that, thanks.
Well, another shame to BMW. F10 body is the same, production is deeply robotized and automated. Why not to give the people breakfast, lunch and dinner at their own wish and cost?
The same way I had to replace the one-sided stock exhaust on my 530dX, M Sport blah-blah.. that looked strange even compared to my neighbor's Hyundai Azera with the dual tips that seem to be not worse than the ones of the best 550.
And, coming back to the matter: VDC is really worth every penny, compared to my so-called "M sport suspension" which is bagging to get both sway bars and springs upgraded for another 700-800 Euro.
Lessons learned

[C5 FOR]

This car does indeed not have DHP, budgetary constraints aside, i just really wanted the 520d.

I spec'd the matt chrome to make the change from the total black v white previous 2011 - 2014 model I had been running. I appreciate its not standard classic M Sport BMW styling but I didnt want that, I wanted a car that suited me after the "white phase" and as such went after it with some gusto.

Jesus, "after it with some gusto".

Bottom line, I love my Falcon. Each of us to our own and full respect with it, gusto or otherwise.

[C5 FOR]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Thanks for writing this comparison.
Enjoyed reading it.

Love LED lights and when I saw them first time

Just wondering why bmw left the windows trim in silver if its M sport car?

I chose the matt alluminium finish. with the 464M's and the ambient lighting chrome exterior trims on the door handles PLUS the Modern Touring all Chrome kidney grilles. I stepped away from the traditional M Sport styling for 1 simple reason......... I needed some colour in my life, black and white was killing me.

[JLR1969]

I have the adaptive headlights on my F10 but not the LED option, I am also constantly amazed when the car changes the beam pattern especially when the high beam is on full and you are driving with a car in front and the lights move out to the left and right

Another must have for me is active cruise, makes for a very relaxed if lazy drive!

Just sit there and the car does everything (except steer)

Perfect long distance cruiser, would love more power but as its a company car and spends 85% on motorways not much point.

[Pottsy]

Originally Posted by C5 FOR

On the previous F11, I used the paddles a handful of times in 3 years and whilst they are good on roads where you don’t have to turn the wheel and can keep your fingers on the paddles continuously as soon as the wheel needs to do a 90 deg plus turn, you don’t have control of the gears any longer. Would appreciate your feedback on this point, yes there’s a case to be made that you make the gear changes before turning into the corner, hence no need to make a shift up (or down) when you are in the corner, I just felt that the shifts between the gears were quite short and needed to be made more quickly as you were exiting a corner and crucially before the wheel was back to less than the 90deg and then having to get your fingers back on the paddles again..........

I agree entirely with the paddles bit. IMO they are useful for two things only - marketing, and a quick down change in anticipation of an overtake.

However, the BMW implementation of the auto box is good enough for me to still avoid a manual for two reasons:

1. The BMW is fitted with a manual gearstick. So I can pop the stick to the left and now change gears entirely manually with my left hand. Not even remotely possible on my Jag.
2. The new GPS-enabled auto box spookily gets it right 99.9% of the time. It drops gears more enthusiastically going into (and round) a roundabout, it holds gears round corners, it gives you higher rpm when you are about to accelerate up a motorway sliproad and so on.

I'd never have a sports car with anything other than a manual, but the ZF 8HP with the GPS thing is pretty good for a saloon car.

[wicked5]

Originally Posted by JLR1969

I have the adaptive headlights on my F10 but not the LED option, I am also constantly amazed when the car changes the beam pattern especially when the high beam is on full and you are driving with a car in front and the lights move out to the left and right

Another must have for me is active cruise, makes for a very relaxed if lazy drive!

Just sit there and the car does everything (except steer)

Perfect long distance cruiser, would love more power but as its a company car and spends 85% on motorways not much point.

The F10 was the first car I have owned with xenon's and I am very impressed with the adaptive lights on my 2010 model. I would definetly sacrifice any luxury interior changes for the lights alone.

[pr0gi]

Do you think there is a difference between the LEDs of the 5 series and the X3? I just noticed that the X3's LED have something inside the core making them brighter. Not that it would make a huge difference though...Just wondering since im on the fence which one to buy. There is a 5 series in the showroom with a very little miles on it and I can take it immediately or wait for brand new X3. Both are xdrive, same engine and price. Although, 5 series is superior in any way to the X3 i dont know what I am even thinking

[C5 FOR]

Originally Posted by Pottsy

However, the BMW implementation of the auto box is good enough for me to still avoid a manual for two reasons:

1. The BMW is fitted with a manual gearstick. So I can pop the stick to the left and now change gears entirely manually with my left hand. Not even remotely possible on my Jag.
2. The new GPS-enabled auto box spookily gets it right 99.9% of the time. It drops gears more enthusiastically going into (and round) a roundabout, it holds gears round corners, it gives you higher rpm when you are about to accelerate up a motorway sliproad and so on.

Re point 1, can we really describe the gearstick when popped to the left as "manual" with the auto box, yes, you can flip it forward or backward and it changes gear for you, the point being the software does it for you, its only manual in terms of when you want the change to be done, theres no feeling to it, changing gear with a clutch is truly manual IMO, you cant flip the throttle when the software is doing it for you, coz your right foots still in the same position on the throttle when you asked the software for the change. theres a world of difference in a flip in mid true manual change and then flooring it as you feed out the clutch. My overall point here is that I missed that about driving the auto box (with software manual option). I wanted to get back to real driving.

Your second point re the (cough, cough) Jags, GPS-enabled auto box sounds like a marvellous piece of kit, driven of course by software (note to self - you're beginning to sound anti-software!!) and of course it will be a big seller, but I just wondered if we are going to far the other way, I think of myself as a driver, not a point and press man, sorry "person", i want to to drive my car, not be softened (oops) up by the very nice kit that is available to only IMO dampen the overall feeling I want from the car.

[C5 FOR]

Originally Posted by pr0gi

Do you think there is a difference between the LEDs of the 5 series and the X3? I just noticed that the X3's LED have something inside the core making them brighter. Not that it would make a huge difference though...Just wondering since im on the fence which one to buy. There is a 5 series in the showroom with a very little miles on it and I can take it immediately or wait for brand new X3. Both are xdrive, same engine and price. Although, 5 series is superior in any way to the X3 i dont know what I am even thinking

The Adaptive LEDS on my 5 have the horizontal LED array in the middle of each of the 4 corona rings. When the headlights are on all 4 rings have the headlights on all the time and show as a beam across the centre with distinctive gaps to the top and bottom flat edge of the ring (which is why I think the Engineers flattened the rings in the first place). These headlights are very disctinctive and do not look like normal (sorry) Xenons that fill the full round corona ring and only on the outside ring as the inside headlights are used for main beam.

I havent lookeat the X3 spec but I would speculate that the spec is the same, the photos you put up just show the central horizontal LED beams further forward in the array for the 3 v the 5. I think mine are deeper based on that photo.

[Pottsy]

C5 FOR,

Just for clarity, the GPS-enabled 'box is on the 5 series, not the Jag.

I get what you are saying though. But for me, I want a saloon car to be point and press, and I want a sports car to be manual and fun. I think of the 5 as a bit of a barge with rather nasty steering - so am happy to keep it as a barge and get it to do all the work for me.

[C5 FOR]

Originally Posted by Pottsy

I think of the 5 as a bit of a barge with rather nasty steering

A bit of a ba...... bar........barg........nope, I can't even say the word!!!

How dare you sir, if these were the old days I would slap you across the face with my gloves and challenge you to a duel!!!

I fear you may have stirred a hornets nest with that comment!!!

[Pottsy]

I know - I have no brand loyalty...

I have good experience of the E Class, XF and 5. All are barges - they are all medium/large saloon cars and drive as such. If you want sporty, you need a sports car, not a saloon car. Thinking a saloon car is a sports car is as flawed as thinking a sports car is a saloon car.

Of the 3 (E, XF, 5), the 5 has the worst steering, by far. The XF is the best, and in a different league (coupled with the fact that it has a non-twisted driving position). The XF has the smoothest engine, too - none of the rattles, growls and vibrations that you get in a 6 cyl 5 series. But the 5 has more grunt, a better implementation of the 8HP 'box, better ride and body control and nicer tech (make that a lot nicer).

IMO the perfect mid/large 3 box saloon (or estate variant) would have it's attributes taken from the following cars:

XF: Steering, driving position, engine smoothness and quietness, looks.
5: Engine grunt, gearbox, ride and handling, interior and tech.
E: Nothing that I can think of.

Caveats:

I would rate the ride quality in the following order (best at the top):

1. 5 Adaptive drive
2. E Class
3. XF
4. 5 Conventional, non M Sport
5. 5 M Sport

I would rate the handling in the following order (best at the top):

1. 5 M Sport / 5 Adaptive drive (can't split them)
2. XF
3. 5 Conventional, non M Sport
4. E Class

Just my experience and opinion - after plenty of time in all those cars.

[C5 FOR]

Pottsy,

Respect your opinion and clearly experience in all "brands" which I don't have. That said I would never go near the XF. It is quite simply an ugly car. The daytime running lights are neither one thing or the other and don't give it any decent character, then there's the roundedness of the bodywork in general, it just doesn't work for me at all. So, strange as it may seem, even if it has improved steering and have a better engine than the 5, I wouldn't go anywhere near it.

[Pottsy]

Originally Posted by C5 FOR

It is quite simply an ugly car. The daytime running lights are neither one thing or the other and don't give it any decent character, then there's the roundedness of the bodywork in general,

I'm a roundy, you're a squary.

Luckily for me, I don't really care about looks from the outside - evidenced by the fact that I bought a W212 E class. I have to say though, that it was the XF that got the most "nice looking car" comments - the E and the 5 tend not to. E got "taxi" comments, 5 gets comments to do with driving aggression and indicator skills. As I say, people can think what they like - I am the type who enjoys smaller diameter wheels because they are less fashionable (and work better).

Did a little comparison montage - when you do this it's remarkable how similar the cars actually look! And I know, the chicken shed needs some maintenance.

[C5 FOR]

Originally Posted by Pottsy

I have to say though, that it was the XF that got the most "nice looking car" comments

Attachment 1139592

Really?? And where was that, the XF fan Sunday review club?

Sorry!!! I'm sorry, I apologise! I think it was the "you're a squary" comment that got me going. Couldn't resist!!!

I wish I had your "dont give a shit what it looks like attitude to my cars" if I did I would be running around in my old mk2 Escort, with the black rubber spoiler on the boot (had to order them special at the time) and the chrome inserts on the GL "sport" wheels.

Those were the days!!!

Sorry, I digress. Full of apologies tonight be I!!