[TheBlackGT]

Hey fellas,

Just curious on hearing back from any of you who been able to drive similar RWD and X-Drive BMWs, particularly the 550 model.

What are the some of the biggest differences between the two? I know the AWD definitely launches harder, but what about handling-wise?

Curious to get your insight. Thanks everyone.

[Bbb34]

For me personally AWD, while really good, didn't quite match the sweetness that you get in corners with RWD.

It's hard to describe but that push coming out of the corner and a bit of over-steer with RWD is what I personally like, other members of the forum might disagree.

Perhaps I'm biased and "old school" but to me RWD is what BMW is (or should be) all about. Now of course, I'm fully aware that AWD is smarter, safer choice, especially in the winter, but for me, it's ever so slightly less fun to drive.

[TheBlackGT]

Originally Posted by Bbb34

For me personally AWD, while really good, didn't quite match the sweetness that you get in corners with RWD.

It's hard to describe but that push coming out of the corner and a bit of over-steer with RWD is what I personally like, other members of the forum might disagree.

Perhaps I'm biased and "old school" but to me RWD is what BMW is (or should be) all about. Now of course, I'm fully aware that AWD is smarter, safer choice, especially in the winter, but for me, it's ever so slightly less fun to drive.

I can't say I disagree boss. Through all the wheelspin, oversteer, and bald rear tires, RWD is truly a joy to drive.

Only reason is I was looking at a potential upgrade, and it has almost everything I want. However, this one is X-Drive and not RWD. Although I will miss it, just curious to see what I like/hate about AWD.

Thanks again for the input.

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by TheBlackGT

Through all the wheelspin, oversteer, and bald rear tires, RWD is truly a joy to drive.

All that's given, and to top it all off, I live in area where we have lots of snow 4 months every year. But as you already know it's simply addictive to corner with RWD.

AWD is smart(er?) choice though, hard to argue with that .

[TheBlackGT]

Originally Posted by Bbb34

All that's given, and to top it all off, I live in area where we have lots of snow 4 months every year. But as you already know it's simply addictive to corner with RWD.

AWD is smart(er?) choice though, hard to argue with that .

It really is. I mean I already have a truck for daily driving and the GT is more of the luxury toy for the weekends/nice drives. The only advantage to AWD I see over RWD is the pull from a standstill, and slightly more grip during cornering probably.

Have you driven both a RWD and AWD 550 personally?

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by TheBlackGT

Have you driven both a RWD and AWD 550 personally?

No, sorry, should've clarified my experience was with 535 not 550.

And look, I might be biased here since it's what I own - though I did compare and "put my money where my mouth is" .

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by TheBlackGT

Hey fellas,

Just curious on hearing back from any of you who been able to drive similar RWD and X-Drive BMWs, particularly the 550 model.

What are the some of the biggest differences between the two? I know the AWD definitely launches harder, but what about handling-wise?

Curious to get your insight. Thanks everyone.

550...I'd go X Drive. It does take a little learning cure to learn how to drive an AWD vehicle in a spirited manner if you're used to RWD BMW's. Once that's done, the full capabilities of the motor can be used.

It's a sin to say this, but the N63 and S63 ///M cars need AWD. There just simply isn't a way to get enough grip to take on the amount of torque put down in a straight line and especially around corners.

As an added bonus, 550ix has hydraulic steering instead of electric.

[Surly73]

You cant get 704 with AWD and you're severely limited for aftermarket shocks or coilovers. I have AWD and while noticeably superior a few times per year I'd rather have RWD back. Been driving RWD bimmers since '01

[TheBlackGT]

Originally Posted by Surly73

You cant get 704 with AWD and you're severely limited for aftermarket shocks or coilovers. I have AWD and while noticeably superior a few times per year I'd rather have RWD back. Been driving RWD bummers since '01

Not true, the GT runs a different setup than the regular F10 550. This one has the special 7MP (sports package) shared with the F01 and the DHP (dynamic handling package). Also, my custom lowering setup works on X-Drive.

Thanks for the input though, much appreciated.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Surly73

You cant get 704 with AWD and you're severely limited for aftermarket shocks or coilovers. I have AWD and while noticeably superior a few times per year I'd rather have RWD back. Been driving RWD bummers since '01

It's a matter of opinion no? Some like 704 M Suspension. Some don't. Some like DHP, some don't.
If time behind the wheel of BMW's is a stick you think is a measurement of what's good or not, I've been in them since '91, have driven every single model in that time extensively, have a few thousand hours of track experience racing and instructing, and am currently on my 39th personal BMW. I also am in the automotive business, manufacturing and distributing suspension components and wheels just to name two elements.

I haven't driven a single stock 5, 6, or 7 that didn't feel compromised in at least one way (including ///M Variants). None of them are perfect but certain combinations suit different models better than others. Since the OP specifically is inquiring about a 550, it is better suited to AWD and DHP. The N63 and N63TU are veritable torque monsters, meeting or exceeding the torque output of all but 1 NA BMW engine (N73B67 in the Phantom) and does so at a very early point of the power-band. Xdrive allows more of that power to be used not only in a straight line, but in cornering as well by raising the powertrain limit of adhesion at the rear in high lateral loads. Slight adaptation in driving style is needed to eek out the full advantages and there are some minor drawbacks, but it's not as if it suddenly turns the car into a Bentley Flying Spur. If one wants to have a bit of fun, the tail will happily step out to play too.

[Royce Martin]

Originally Posted by miamiten

It's a matter of opinion no? Some like 704 M Suspension. Some don't. Some like DHP, some don't.
If time behind the wheel of BMW's is a stick you think is a measurement of what's good or not, I've been in them since '91, have driven every single model in that time extensively, have a few thousand hours of track experience racing and instructing, and am currently on my 39th personal BMW. I also am in the automotive business, manufacturing and distributing suspension components and wheels just to name two elements.

I haven't driven a single stock 5, 6, or 7 that didn't feel compromised in at least one way (including ///M Variants). None of them are perfect but certain combinations suit different models better than others. Since the OP specifically is inquiring about a 550, it is better suited to AWD and DHP. The N63 and N63TU are veritable torque monsters, meeting or exceeding the torque output of all but 1 NA BMW engine (N73B67 in the Phantom) and does so at a very early point of the power-band. Xdrive allows more of that power to be used not only in a straight line, but in cornering as well by raising the powertrain limit of adhesion at the rear in high lateral loads. Slight adaptation in driving style is needed to eek out the full advantages and there are some minor drawbacks, but it's not as if it suddenly turns the car into a Bentley Flying Spur. If one wants to have a bit of fun, the tail will happily step out to play too.

+1 AWD and RWD both have it's advantages and disadvantages. I'm going to say go with AWD, I own a 650xi Gran Coupe and I've driven the RWD and it completely sucks to me, on corners sometimes you have to take it easy but it does feel more spirited, now imagine that with an instant pull off that turn instead of wheel spin. I'm from the east side (NY). I'm speaking from experience with NY roads and corners.

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by miamiten

I haven't driven a single stock 5, 6, or 7 that didn't feel compromised in at least one way (including ///M Variants). None of them are perfect but certain combinations suit different models better than others........

......Slight adaptation in driving style is needed to eek out the full advantages and there are some minor drawbacks, but it's not as if it suddenly turns the car into a Bentley Flying Spur. If one wants to have a bit of fun, the tail will happily step out to play too.

I’m interested to hear your suggestions on adjusting your driving style for AWD – not doubting what you’re saying, genuinely interested in some quick tips?

Might be weight difference between the two, suspension height or my driving style, not certain, but I felt that comparing to RWD, there’s slight undesteer turning in, and coming out of the corners with AWD. Of course you have to be smarter with the throttle coming out of the turn with RWD, but I personally like that.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Bbb34

I’m interested to hear your suggestions on adjusting your driving style for AWD – not doubting what you’re saying, genuinely interested in some quick tips?

Might be weight difference between the two, suspension height or my driving style, not certain, but I felt that comparing to RWD, there’s slight undesteer turning in, and coming out of the corners with AWD. Of course you have to be smarter with the throttle coming out of the turn with RWD, but I personally like that.

Possibly but it will be very limited. It's extremely difficult to give feedback without being present.

What two are you comparing?

What were the specs of each?

What were the conditions? Public road or a closed course?

Were the conditions the same for both, back to back, or different times, same or different location?

What type of real driver training have you had? Car Control? HPDE? None?

What were the previous 2-4 vehicles you've spent the most time in driving spiritedly?

Doesn't matter if its a FWD, RWD, AWD, front, rear, or mid engines car. It all comes down to one basic principle...inertial management. Getting behind the trend or blowing past it will bite back either way.

I count myself fortunate to have never had a crash on track with myself at the wheel (riding shotgun as an instructor is another story). It only took one event at Sebring in turn 1 during an HPDE at 120ish mph when I allowed myself to get behind the car for a fraction of a second. Was in a brand new 996 GT2 and braked about 50' too late. That tiny difference meant I went through that turn facing the wrong way twice without a full rotation in either direction.

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by miamiten

Possibly but it will be very limited. It's extremely difficult to give feedback without being present.

Fair enough, seems that you're pushing your cars much closer to the handling limit than I do. I don't track my cars, and am never blown away by straight line top speed, it's great to get places in Europe, but, not a priority for me. I do however appreciate "decent" 0-60 times, and love "spirited" driving on the roads full of twists and turns, my feedback is mostly based on that.

Recent (last 2+ years) drives, well, older (great fun to drive) 330i M sport, current models of X1, X3, 320xi, 228xi, 335xi, few different flavors of 5 series, Audi A4, S5, A6, 2007 Porsche Boxter, 2014 Mustang GT, recent (can't recall year) Mini S, RR Evoke, current VW GTI, Skoda Fabia, Older Fiat Brava, Older Impreza WRX, Ford Fiesta, Alfa Romeo 164, Peugeot 508SE, Seat Toledo, Renault Clio, Venza, GMC Acadia, Outback, Accord, several generation of Passats (B5 to current), Acura TL, MDX, Infinity G35S, Benz e350, M350 and R350, Volvo XC90, XC70 and X60 ... might be missing a few

So you are correct, I didn't really compare them with same tires, same suspension, same road back to back, just a general feel I have about how different drive trains handle given I'm lucky enough to try few different cars every now and then, different continents, very different conditions and driving cultures. Somehow, to me, RWD always feels special, matter of preference I suppose. Was just wondering if there's some quick and easy tip in terms of me, maybe missing something very obvious with AWD cars.

But, enough derailing the thread, I think we're in agreement, AWD is smartest buy for OP, no doubt, especially since he already has lots of experience with RWD and is looking to move on.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Bbb34

Fair enough, seems that you're pushing your cars much closer to the handling limit than I do. I don't track my cars, and am never blown away by straight line top speed, it's great to get places in Europe, but, not a priority for me. I do however appreciate "decent" 0-60 times, and love "spirited" driving on the roads full of twists and turns, my feedback is mostly based on that.

Recent (last 2+ years) drives, well, older (great fun to drive) 330i M sport, current models of X1, X3, 320xi, 228xi, 335xi, few different flavors of 5 series, Audi A4, S5, A6, 2007 Porsche Boxter, 2014 Mustang GT, recent (can't recall year) Mini S, RR Evoke, current VW GTI, Skoda Fabia, Older Fiat Brava, Older Impreza WRX, Ford Fiesta, Alfa Romeo 164, Peugeot 508SE, Seat Toledo, Renault Clio, Venza, GMC Acadia, Outback, Accord, several generation of Passats (B5 to current), Acura TL, MDX, Infinity G35S, Benz e350, M350 and R350, Volvo XC90, XC70 and X60 ... might be missing a few

So you are correct, I didn't really compare them with same tires, same suspension, same road back to back, just a general feel I have about how different drive trains handle given I'm lucky enough to try few different cars every now and then, different continents, very different conditions and driving cultures. Somehow, to me, RWD always feels special, matter of preference I suppose. Was just wondering if there's some quick and easy tip in terms of me, maybe missing something very obvious with AWD cars.

But, enough derailing the thread, I think we're in agreement, AWD is smartest buy for OP, no doubt, especially since he already has lots of experience with RWD and is looking to move on.

I don't really think it's derailment of the thread. Yes there are some specifics from the OP, but also its a general discussion between Sdrive and Xdrive.

Good variety of cars you listed and many have their specific nuances about them.

Driving on a public road vs a closed course definitely is different, even if the public road is well known, and tends to amplify the inherent handling characteristics of the car because the driver is typically getting ahead of and behind the weight transfer curve, often back and forth between the two in the same corner.

But for this part, let's take a an F10 535i vs 535ix as a specific. Xdrive has slightly better weight distribution even though it's heavier. This mass is low on the CoG and mostly immediately behind the front axle. This will give it a minuscule advantage in neutral handling characteristics. The thing with Xdrive to keep in mind is how the system works. Approaching a flat corner, the torque split is 40/60 F/R and 50/50 L/R on the rear axle. As the accelerometer detects the lateral acceleration change on turn in, the F/R split switches to 20/80. As power is introduced, the L/R vectoring will adjust to keep the rear on track. It does this by applying a small amount of brake to the inside wheel. The DTC/DSC/Drive Mode Selector Settings will make this more or less pronounced but never keep the rear diff completely locked 50/50. As the car comes out of the apex and lateral loads begin to come down, the F/R split moves back towards 40/60. If you're on the line, the car should feel very neutral, though I can understand a feeling of front end push on entrance and exit that isn't actually understeer but rather the feedback from the torque split changes. Slightly earlier braking on the approach, do not trail brake, stay on line for the turn in, but gently begin to apply power just before the apex and roll all the way in to the throttle as you track out.

All the F10's I've driven have "atypical BMW" characteristics compared to past models. But they are what they are and wishing for or comparing to them doesn't do much good. Adapting to what is present is the only option. The high torque RWD F10's though, have a trap. They can be very neutral and easily managed with the throttle, except when there is a sudden spike in vertical acceleration upon exiting a turn under partial throttle. It's just enough that the rear unloads, and more torque is being transmitted at the same time to the rear than it can handle. The rear simply let's go suddenly. Even the best drivers can easily be caught off guard by this. Just look at the number of incidents with the F10 Ring Taxi compared to the previous E60.