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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 F10 Technical Topics Navigation, iDrive, Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Phone, Coding Upgraded Sound System recommended for F10 ?
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      12-14-2010, 12:45 PM   #45
krell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaishang View Post
That's suprising because I think the standard system is totally, totally crap. Woeful even, for a £40,000 car. I've tried out various combinations of E90s and F10s with standard (easily spotted by the lack of door tweeters) audio and upgraded audio. The standard system is 4x25W, not enough power to drive the subwoofers, no tweeters, cheap components and distorts at even moderate volume levels. If I had a bedside clock radio that sounded like BMW standard audio, I'd throw it in the bin and go back to a wind-up alarm clock. It's crap.

It depends on what you're looking for, and what type of music you listen to. I noticed that the standard system was good with jazz music over DAB. I was quite surprised at how good it was.

I have a high end system at home so I know what good quality audio sounds like - and I think the standard system is fine for a no cost option. It's certainly not perfect, of course. The biggest let down is that the bass could be tighter - but that can be corrected to a degree by turning down the bass a little.

As always, try before you buy to avoid dissapointment.

Last edited by krell; 12-14-2010 at 12:52 PM..
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      12-14-2010, 01:57 PM   #46
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I personally have the "upgraded" sound system and it's fantastic. I think it's a worthwhile option.
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      12-15-2010, 03:47 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krell View Post
It's a small point, but BMW are using the wrong terminology.

By definition, a midrange speaker cannot handle high frequencies so if they were indeed midrange speakers you would get a very muted sound with very little treble or high frequencies.

They are actually full range speakers that can handle frequencies across most of the audible range - except low bass. Lots of cars have them - and some have a tweeter built into the centre of the speaker to simplify installation. I haven't seen the actual speaker to see what type they use.
In the second posting in this thread by carl_d, the HiFi Business and HiFi Professional systems are described and they (BMW) mention 'mid-range' and 'tweeters' separately. Indeed they are separate speakers in these systems. So how would it be (according to you), that when they describe the basic system and they mention mid-range speakers, that they actually mean full-range speakers?

Last edited by jj9876; 12-15-2010 at 05:02 AM..
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      12-15-2010, 06:25 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jj9876 View Post
In the second posting in this thread by carl_d, the HiFi Business and HiFi Professional systems are described and they (BMW) mention 'mid-range' and 'tweeters' separately. Indeed they are separate speakers in these systems. So how would it be (according to you), that when they describe the basic system and they mention mid-range speakers, that they actually mean full-range speakers?
In the case of the basic system it is a mis-use of terms by BMW.

I've been involved in audio for over 25 years and have designed my own speakers in the past. I know that a midrange speaker by definition is limited in the range of frequencies it can reproduce, starting at around 300 Hz and stopping at around 5000 Hz.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid-range_speaker

Note that the accepted audible range is between 20 Hz and 20,000 Hz.

I have the standard audio system and it is clear that the upper range goes way beyond 5000 Hz. Besides, it makes no sense at all that BMW would install a system that is limited to around 5000 Hz and ignores the upper 15,000 Hz. It would be an incredibly stupid thing to do.

What they have, therefore, is a full range speaker that can handle middle and high frequencies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full-range

Why do some speaker systems employ separate midrange speakers and tweeters? Because it is generally accepted that a speaker that has been optimized to work in a specific frequency range will work better than a speaker that needs to work over a broader range of frequencies. But it depends on the speaker and it's supporting electronics. Some of the very best speakers out there employ two speakers only - a bass/midrange speaker and a tweeter.
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      12-15-2010, 07:25 AM   #49
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Okay, if we assume it is a misuse of terms by BMW for the standard sound system:

From your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full-range

In the critical reaction section it says:

'Reproducing multiple frequencies with the same diaphragm causes intermodulation distortion, a non-linear effect that occurs when one surface attempts to reproduce both frequencies simultaneously. The audible severity of modest 'intermodulation distortion' is not well established. The result is a degree of "frequency mixing", albeit at a relatively low level. A full range driver may have reduced output at both ends of its frequency range, or a more severely limited frequency response, resulting in a more compromised sound'.

The description sounds about right in terms of what I can hear through the standard sound system, 'intermodulation' distortion at mid to high volume levels. The bass doesn't sound right either, presumably that's coming from the sub-woofers.

Last edited by jj9876; 12-15-2010 at 11:37 AM..
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      12-15-2010, 10:04 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jj9876 View Post
Okay, if we assume it is a misuse of terms by BMW for the standard sound system:

From your link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full-range

In the critical reaction section it says:

'Reproducing multiple frequencies with the same diaphragm causes intermodulation distortion, a non-linear effect that occurs when one surface attempts to reproduce both frequencies simultaneously. The audible severity of modest 'intermodulation distortion' is not well established. The result is a degree of "frequency mixing", albeit at a relatively low level. A full range driver may have reduced output at both ends of its frequency range, or a more severely limited frequency response, resulting in a more compromised sound'.

The description sounds about right in terms of what I can hear through the standard sound system, 'intermodulation' distortion at mid to high volume levels. The bass doesn't sound right neither, presumably that's coming from the sub-woofers.
I think this is a technical explaination for my previous comment: the standard system is crap.

BMWs competitors are using 10 speakers and 400 watts in their cars. It's not suprising 100W total with no separate amp and 6 speakers in a BMW does not sound good.
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      12-15-2010, 11:32 AM   #51
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Another possible indication that the basic system is compromised, is the fact that the basic UK system is not available in the US. Their basic system is HiFi Business.

What possible business reason would make BMW decide to put HiFi Business as the basic system in the US?
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      12-18-2010, 07:06 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jj9876 View Post
Another possible indication that the basic system is compromised, is the fact that the basic UK system is not available in the US. Their basic system is HiFi Business.

What possible business reason would make BMW decide to put HiFi Business as the basic system in the US?
Yes, this is the question... and the answer is clear: because if BMW did offer it in the US, it would have to deal with complaints that never end, and maybe even law suites... that's how poor my standard 6 spkr system is.

It's clear BMW knows this very well, but still decided to sell it in some countries.
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      10-28-2011, 12:52 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akhter View Post

Speakers
a) base level (not available in US) is 4ch amp 6 speakers
Hi, does anyone has picture of that amp, I need to get signal for aftermarket amp and can not find good source. Thanx in advance
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      05-16-2012, 02:12 PM   #54
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Sorry to bring up an old topic, but just wondering if anyone in the UK has sucessfully upgraded the basic sound system?

I'm thinking of fitting a set of the top hi-fi tweets as a start.
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      06-18-2012, 10:18 AM   #55
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so...i'm wandering which is better? H/K or HiFi?
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      06-18-2012, 11:03 AM   #56
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One thing has to be made clear here, the standard system on US-spec cars is not the same as the hi-fi loudspeaker system (or business hi-fi in UK speak) available in other markets.
The standard US system has 10 speakers & an analogue amp, the hi-fi system (option 676) has 12 speakers & digital amp. Option 676 is not available in the US.
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      06-18-2012, 02:44 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kendoz View Post
so...i'm wandering which is better? H/K or HiFi?
H/K as in Harman Kardon? But that's not an option in the F10. What sound system options do you get in Taiwan?
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      06-18-2012, 05:10 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by remmib View Post
H/K as in Harman Kardon? But that's not an option in the F10. What sound system options do you get in Taiwan?
Same as Euro countries - hi-fi & prof hi-fi.
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      06-18-2012, 08:35 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by remmib View Post
H/K as in Harman Kardon? But that's not an option in the F10. What sound system options do you get in Taiwan?
the same as usa...
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      06-18-2012, 10:57 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kendoz View Post
the same as usa...
No, it's different. USA doesn't have 12 spkr hi-fi system. Their standard system is unique & it has 10 spkrs w/analogue amp.
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      06-18-2012, 11:02 PM   #61
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Ok, for Taiwan spec F10 all models from 520i to Activehybrid have 6 speakers as standard. Info source from bmw.com.tw. If that is correct then both hi-fi & prof hi-fi are optional extras.
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      06-18-2012, 11:27 PM   #62
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Get whatever sounds good. The professional system sounds pretty good to me.


You're never going to get an audiophile system for 4 or 8 grand.

A good, top of the line audiophile setup at home usually costs at least $ 150 K, can even reach 500K, this includes room treatments, bass traps, speakers such as Magico/Avalon Acoustics (70 - 110 K for a decent top of the line pair), Spectral Audio amp, preamp, and cd unit (min. 60-70 K for the hardware, 120K if you go with Krell), and at least 30-40 K in cabling (MIT cables). Then you need premium audio software/cd's to run, they can be gold plated etc. Very expensive.



The only truly good sound system on a vehicle is the Burmeister system for Porsche.
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      06-20-2012, 06:38 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence View Post
Ok, for Taiwan spec F10 all models from 520i to Activehybrid have 6 speakers as standard. Info source from bmw.com.tw. If that is correct then both hi-fi & prof hi-fi are optional extras.
many friends said the 6 speakers as standard is shit...

and i'm going to get a 528 this year, i'm wandering choose the hi-fi or not...
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      06-20-2012, 11:55 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kendoz View Post
many friends said the 6 speakers as standard is shit...

and i'm going to get a 528 this year, i'm wandering choose the hi-fi or not...
If within budget get at least the hi-fi. The std 6 speakers cost time & money to upgrade aftermarket, cos I suspect it's designed like the E9x where the rear speaker outputs are not full range.
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      05-22-2014, 06:40 AM   #65
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edit.

moved my post to
http://f10.5post.com/forums/showthre...=826339&page=5


as its newer.

Last edited by suj999; 05-22-2014 at 06:49 AM..
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      11-28-2014, 11:15 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gorban View Post
And while were discussing the HiFi, how on earth do you pause the stereo??? Pushing the volume nob on the stereo only mutes. Is there a way to pause using the buttons on the steering wheel?
Amen. Stereo controls are limited in the F10 and the stock system is terrible, the BSW upgrade is well worth it

Last edited by RPLB530; 11-29-2014 at 03:49 PM..
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