[mob17]

I had fully comp insurance on my 335d a couple of years ago for £43/month with no excess. Car was 6 years old at the time with 58k miles.

The F10 520D 2013 with 46k miles has come up to 3 years, so i thought i will get fully comp, and was expecting it to be cheaper than the 335d due to a smaller engine, less miles and being newer. However the quote came back at over £100/month. Is this for real? What are you guys paying?

[gtthree]

I noticed a similar change when I moved from my e92 330d (company car) to the F10 530d (self purchased).

In the end I deceided that I would go without a warranty, should anything fail then I will use the money I save to pay for any repair that may be needed.

These cars are not expensive to keep in good order as you have BMWs largest customer base on your doorstep in Germany and I have imported genuine front discs and pads at a tremendous saving over a UK dealer.
I'd imagine injectors, dpf's, suspension are similar.
If your idrive fails you can always buy a secondhand one for c£400, and code it to your car.

But it depends on your spec, if you have every option ticketed such as radar cruise, comfort vented seats, vdc, hud then as these are rarer more expensive parts I might be swayed to a warranty.

You could try Mondial and see if they are more competitive than BMW.

[kinhwear]

Are we talking warranty or car insurance?

Car insurance depends on where you live ( Post Code ) and age.

I pay £250pa fully comp for a 18 month old F11 530d with all the toys.

But then I live in Devon and am old!!

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by mob17

I had fully comp insurance on my 335d a couple of years ago for £43/month with no excess. Car was 6 years old at the time with 58k miles.

The F10 520D 2013 with 46k miles has come up to 3 years, so i thought i will get fully comp, and was expecting it to be cheaper than the 335d due to a smaller engine, less miles and being newer. However the quote came back at over £100/month. Is this for real? What are you guys paying?

As the insured warranty is flat rate for the model range (subject to mileage), the best value is for the higher end, well optioned examples.

I have comprehensive cover with the additional emergency cover and opted for the £100 excess. I bought a year, as no intention of selling this coming period. Works out at £70 a month, for the under 60,000 mile cover. My reasoning on the £100 excess is, I can make 2 claims in the year before I'm out of pocket, compared to the £0 excess.

My car is less than 40,000 miles, already had over a £1,000 of warranty work this period, and another fault in the Comfort Access has developed, so will be well in balance this year. And I'm only half way through the year.

It is the complexity in something like my car, (it's a £60k motor) with many of the options which, if they fail, will be expensive to fix. Options like Self levelling suspension (one air spring already replaced), Adaptive Drive, HUD, panoramic roof, full setup of cameras (one already replaced), speed limit recognition, Pro Nav, Comfort Access (one door handle already replaced) etc., etc.

Emergency cover tagged on, also links it all together, if recovered you get a hire car for the duration of the fix. Had one recovery in the current car under the extend warranty, with a hire car for 3-days. All that for what appeared a simple Comfort Access issue. Messed the electrics due to battery drain and shut down essential services.

For me it is a 'peace of mind' and fixed cost cover.

Over the years with BMW I've always had value from the extended warranty. In fact I'm well in credit, as I've had more problems (well I hope so) than the average failure rate.

This is with low mileage BMWs, given extra care and attention than the typical service regime. Nothing I could have done would have prevented the issues I've had, nothing due to neglect.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by kinhwear

Are we talking warranty or car insurance?

Car insurance depends on where you live ( Post Code ) and age.

I pay £250pa fully comp for a 18 month old F11 530d with all the toys.

But then I live in Devon and am old!!

This is the insured 'extended' warranty we can get from BMW, for year 4 onward.

[kinhwear]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

This is the insured 'extended' warranty we can get from BMW, for year 4 onward.

Should have read the topic title!

[MrPogle]

Originally Posted by gtthree

In the end I deceided that I would go without a warranty, should anything fail then I will use the money I save to pay for any repair that may be needed.

I have been doing just that for a good few years now. Literally, putting the premium into a savings account every month. I've had to dip into it a few times over the years to fix stuff but there is still a few grand in there. A bonus is that, if you are fixing a car not covered by a BMW warranty, it is much cheaper to fix. When the BMW warranty does £1000 of work on your car it would have only cost you maybe £500.

The problem with this approach is that if you get unlucky early on, you need to get a loan. You also need to be strong willed enough not to raid the savings account. This could be difficult if your boiler has just unexpectedly packed in. You will make money on the long-run, because insurance companies do, but the long run might be a very long time if you have a few bad years. The BMW Warranty is (by all accounts) zero-hassle come claim/fix time which is a valuable thing.

My 3-year warranty expires next year and I am thinking, for the first time, of getting a BMW warranty for the reasons stated by Highland Pete above. My few grand is going to be pretty useless if my engine has a serious issue or similar. I'll probably pay for the warranty by draining my savings account so it will feel free for a while.

My research suggests pretty strongly that you should either go with BMW or go it alone. The middle-ground of 3rd-party warranty companies is not cheaper enough to justify the hassle if you need to claim.

[shiner]

Completely agree with Highland Pete.
If I keep my 535D F11 and loaded with options car when the warranty expires next year (Dec 2017) and will be on approx 40000 miles by then, I will definitely take up the BMW warranty. In my opinion, these cars are just too complex and expensive (even after three years) to contemplate not having it under BMW's umbrella still.

Repair costs of these things are astronomical. Few warranty jobs cost less than £1000 at BMW rates and anything like a gearbox or engine mechanical could see you looking into multiple-thousands to fix. Maybe BMW "goodwill" could get you out of a pickle if the car developed a serious problem if recently out of the new car three year warranty, but that is by no means guaranteed. Just a £70 flat payment per month and all catered for. Seems a no-brainer to me considering the complexity and if you can afford to buy one of these cars in the first place.

IF you were to put that £70 into the "kitty" you'd only have £840 after one year, during which you'd have to have no problems with the vehicle. Yes you may be lucky and not need to dip into it. But then again you could get a £5000 problem!

As for all insurance, it a is a wager between you and the insurance company. You may not need to claim for five years. Or, you could need to claim three times in the first year....

[mob17]

My thoughts weren't that i can't afford £100 per month, just that i think its too high, compared to my e92 335d quote. If it was £50-70 then i would fully understand the premium compared to the 335d. Yes i know the F10 is newer etc.

I do believe the BMW warranty is the best, process was so smooth for my 335d.

Is anyone out there paying £100 + for their comprehensive warranty?

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by mob17

My thoughts weren't that i can't afford £100 per month, just that i think its too high, compared to my e92 335d quote. If it was £50-70 then i would fully understand the premium compared to the 335d. Yes i know the F10 is newer etc.

I do believe the BMW warranty is the best, process was so smooth for my 335d.

[B]Is anyone out there paying £100 + for their comprehensive warranty?/B]

I took mine out in July and yes it could have been over £100 a month.

Would have been £105, paid monthly, with £0 excess.

I paid the annual charge of £840 with the £100 excess, (equal to £70 per month).

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by MrPogle

The problem with this approach is that if you get unlucky early on, you need to get a loan. You also need to be strong willed enough not to raid the savings account. This could be difficult if your boiler has just unexpectedly packed in. You will make money on the long-run, because insurance companies do, but the long run might be a very long time if you have a few bad years. The BMW Warranty is (by all accounts) zero-hassle come claim/fix time which is a valuable thing.

I've thought of self financing 'the warranty'. As you say, it isn't necessarily a winning situation.

We can't really use "the insurance companies make a profit argument", as they share the risk across all the users. We will either be a winner or loser on cost, (with insurance or self financing) simply due to whether we need repairs, or not. We may never win.

I had a major issue in my second year of an extended warranty, back in 2004. New engine, hire cars for the best part of 12 weeks, while BMW sorted what they were doing with my car, and it covered consequential damage.

That sort of 5-figure sum plays havoc with self financing. Most years I've run an extended warranty, I've had good value from them, and that's without the 'big one'.

Plus personally I'm past the "cheaper fix" solution with these complex cars. My local independent is over 60 miles away, (some of the possible issues will be "a pass" for him), so nothing convenient about it for me, when recoveries and hire cars are part of the warranty deal.

[Martin2C]

I'll be extending my warranty when my car gets to 3 years old, as it will,have done 90k miles by then. I'm a little surprised by the cost, £840-£1200 is more than I expected, as I pay about £800 for the Boxster with no excess and thought that was a bit high.

[MrPogle]

I agree. This is why I'm doing a warranty this time. Previous cars have being fixable by good independents but I suspect even BMW will struggle with bits of my F10 and I'd rather they burned Mondial's money whilst they struggled than mine. Looking at my car now the stakes have become too high to risk being a significant loser. If the clever LED highlights started tracking planes it would generate an annoying bill but if a con rod snapped it would be a different matter. However I do think the risk of being significantly out of pocket with self finance is over stated. In 60 years of motoring you would have contributed over 70k in today's money to your own little insurance company. The risk is spread over teens of cars and you get the option of getting rid of the risk as soon as it starts to make you uncomfortable. You would have to have had bought some proper lemons to be massively out of pocket with that kind of buffer. But, as I said, the long-term might be very long. You are right, though, even insurance companies have gone bust.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by MrPogle

In 60 years of motoring you would have contributed over 70k in today's money to your own little insurance company.

I know what you mean, but inflation on the warranty and general costs aside, I wonder what the money 'pot' would be. The real issue is cars are getting far more complex, and not so sure any more reliable for it either.

For me, I treat the warranty as part of the running cost of a BMW (or other marque), out of manufacturer's warranty.

My sister has just got caught out of warranty with a VW, (just a few days). The bill, without some hard pushing for goodwill, would have been about £6k. Still over £2k and a lot of hassle, the vehicle off the road while it all got debated.

[MrPogle]

Like you say it's about piece of mind more than money and that is very subjective and depends on your financial situation. What keeps you awake at night by the thought of having to buy it again? I insure my house and car because they would. I don't insure my washing machine and mobile phone because they don't.

I think the major downside to the principle (rather than the numbers) of self-finance is that you need to keep the collateral for pretty much your whole life. So having multi-thousands in an account but never being able to spend it on anything nice makes the whole thing seem a bit pointless.

[shiner]

Part of the issue with these exorbitant repair costs is the "replace entire unit" approach by the franchised dealerships nowadays. VANOS playing up? Replace entire VANOS unit. £££Thousands. When it probably was just the O ring seals which can be replaced easily with two hours labour and £30 of parts. I have done it myself on my runaround Z4.

However, that takes competent mechanics. Not in any way to impugn their work but I think BMW engineers (as all other marques) are taught to fix cars with this "black box" approach- replace the entire unit - as opposed to fixing the actual problem. And of course, it costs us/insurance company mega bucks.

[MrPogle]

Completely agree. Over the years I've lost count of the times "my man" has said "dismantled it, cleaned it out and regreased it. It's fine now. Fifty quid." BMW would be 80 to plug it into a machine to tell you there is a fault on a unit that needs replacing for 1000.

To be fair though, my man isn't going to be able to help if my HUD starts to display blurry images.

[shiner]

Originally Posted by MrPogle

Completely agree. Over the years I've lost count of the times "my man" has said "dismantled it, cleaned it out and regreased it. It's fine now. Fifty quid." BMW would be 80 to plug it into a machine to tell you there is a fault on a unit that needs replacing for 1000.

To be fair though, my man isn't going to be able to help if my HUD starts to display blurry images.

Indeed. Yes I have a "my man" as well for SO's car and for my other car. It is surprising how much they *can* actually fix, even electronics stuff. But he can't help with some of the complexities of a modern car, electronic suspension, HUD etc.

EDIT: Also meant to add that BMW are quite mean only offering 3 years of new car warranty. Most of the other "none premium" vendors offer five years. My mate for instance has five years unlimited mileage on his Toyoyta Avensis. This warranty malarkey must be a lucrative business which would imply that the claims paid for versus premiums must be attractively weighted in BMW's favour, i.e. the cars ARE reliable long term. That said, not much good if you are the one with a £12000 engine replacement bill.....

[MrPogle]

I'm sure it is a purely financial/PR/legal decision rather than driven by reliability fundamentals. It looks to me that BMW offer 2 years in USA and 4 years in Canada on what presumably are virtually identical cars.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by MrPogle

Completely agree. Over the years I've lost count of the times "my man" has said "dismantled it, cleaned it out and regreased it. It's fine now. Fifty quid." BMW would be 80 to plug it into a machine to tell you there is a fault on a unit that needs replacing for 1000.

To be fair though, my man isn't going to be able to help if my HUD starts to display blurry images.

I was brought up on fixing everything and that included cars. I see both sides of this issue, The £50 fix often works, but doesn't always last, two or three £50 fixes later and the user still has to get a new part.

Garages don't want that sort of hassle, or customers complaining that the 'fix' didn't work. I could give examples of customers getting quite nasty because the garage "let them down" ... was trying to save them money, but it can backfire.

I've just had trouble with a Camray oil boiler, the Danfoss valve actuator failed. "Again". I needed an immediate and reliable solution, the building required heating within hours, a new actuator fitted. But the "fix it" nature in me has meant I've now got a working spare. I take them apart to find the weakness, first one the micro switch, the second, the motor. Resoldered the good micro switch into the unit with the working motor.

But... if I need to use it, I'll have doubts on its durability. OK as a temporary spare while a new one arrives, but not confident it will give long term service. Sounds good to save £60 (yes it is the most expensive model) for about 30 minutes of my time. But relying on a part worn unit is a gamble.

[mob17]

How come all the recent posts are in bold font?

Anyways, i kinda get both sides' points about it. I guess its just pot luck. I will have a think about this.

[kinhwear]

Not mine!!