[hinckley]

I have both an M5 (summer car) and an S4 (winter car). For me, the M is more powerful and much more luxurious. The S4 is smaller, more nimble and frankly, more fun to drive.

[JNoSol]

Originally Posted by The X Men

The F10 cannot even chase down a A6 in the twisties according to the car and driver test, what make you think it can chase down a smaller and better handling A4?

I didn't mention any A4, I mentioned the weak 2.0T. My 750Li isn't a circuit track race car, but I will catch up at the straight aways on bigger tracks. The only way I would lose, is if an A4 2.0T challenge me in one of those SCCA parking lot cone tracks, then I'm screwed. I used to hate those cone tracks, Mazda MX5s dominate those SCCA races.

As for the F10 vs A6 comparision, were they comparing the 550i vs S6, 535i vs 3.0T, or 528i vs 2.0T? I'm sure the 535i will kill the A6 2.0T. The 550i isn't a match for the S6, but the M5 will give Audi a run for their money.

[jedpause]

You'd be surprised what it can do if you push it, let it go!

[yahtzee]

Originally Posted by R N M

The 2013 Msport comes with the REAL sport suspension and much BETTER steering.

Picking my '13 up on Saturday and I didnt realize the suspension AND steering were improved over 2012...good to know.

[mdrobc13]

A few mods and you'll have a nicely handling ride. I added H&R Springs and Dinan Shockwave Suspension software and 20" wheels and the car handles very nicely now. Floating is a thing of the past. Also my car had the M Sport package and M Sport Suspension. Overall I am very pleased...you do feel the weight guys but its an F10 and 4k lbs car! But from what I've seen the 550i and M5's do have the HP and torque to overcome the weight penalty nicely!

[mlai]

How does horsepower overcome the weight issue in terms of handling?

[The X Men]

Originally Posted by JNoSol

I didn't mention any A4, I mentioned the weak 2.0T. My 750Li isn't a circuit track race car, but I will catch up at the straight aways on bigger tracks. The only way I would lose, is if an A4 2.0T challenge me in one of those SCCA parking lot cone tracks, then I'm screwed. I used to hate those cone tracks, Mazda MX5s dominate those SCCA races.

As for the F10 vs A6 comparision, were they comparing the 550i vs S6, 535i vs 3.0T, or 528i vs 2.0T? I'm sure the 535i will kill the A6 2.0T. The 550i isn't a match for the S6, but the M5 will give Audi a run for their money.

The 750Li, now that is a boat but a very nice boat. The 5 series is basically a mini 7 series these days and it handles almost as bad. The 550i and 750i series have good straight away accelaration, but thats not what handling is about. The optional suspension and the aftermarket add on can help with the handling, but if one compares the handling to a similarly modified A4 or 3 series, the 5 series will fail everytime.
The car and driver comparo was between the 535i and the A6 3.0T. I had a A6 3.0T prior to my F10 and I can tell you that the comparo results were pretty spot on.
As far as the 550i vs S6, its been beat to death by the way, car and driver pick the S6 and E63 AMG over the M5. That kind of tell you where the 550i would have been placed had it been in the comapro.
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test

[Russkey]

Who cares about car & driver review? I would never choose E63 or S6 over M5...

[K-A]

Originally Posted by The X Men

The 750Li, now that is a boat but a very nice boat. The 5 series is basically a mini 7 series these days and it handles almost as bad. The 550i and 750i series have good straight away accelaration, but thats not what handling is about. The optional suspension and the aftermarket add on can help with the handling, but if one compares the handling to a similarly modified A4 or 3 series, the 5 series will fail everytime.
The car and driver comparo was between the 535i and the A6 3.0T. I had a A6 3.0T prior to my F10 and I can tell you that the comparo results were pretty spot on.
As far as the 550i vs S6, its been beat to death by the way, car and driver pick the S6 and E63 AMG over the M5. That kind of tell you where the 550i would have been placed had it been in the comapro.
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test

The comparo was of a 2012 5er, yeah? I wish they're retest the F10's with the 2013 STANDARD Passive suspension. I notice that about all people who complain about the F10's handling have the Active suspension or if a 2013, an XI which is significantly different than the Passive M suspension.

It's BMW's fault really. They should have had this suspension standard on the car all along (on M Sports I mean). I'm not saying it'll out-sport the A6, but it'll certainly get it closer, and I'm sure considering how much more comfortable and luxurious it maintains the F10 to being, might get the dynamics respect it deserves.

[TheBlackGT]

It's funny, but the GT came out before the F10, so the steering on the F07 seems actually better than the new F10 (don't hate me LOL). Seriously though, especially on H&R springs, this GT handles damn well for its weight and size, and I actually the steering feel on this better than an F10 (I've driven one before), feels more like a proper BMW.

P.S. I have the Sport Package and DHP (and ARS I believe), no M package though.

[The X Men]

Originally Posted by K-A

The comparo was of a 2012 5er, yeah? I wish they're retest the F10's with the 2013 STANDARD Passive suspension. I notice that about all people who complain about the F10's handling have the Active suspension or if a 2013, an XI which is significantly different than the Passive M suspension.

It's BMW's fault really. They should have had this suspension standard on the car all along (on M Sports I mean). I'm not saying it'll out-sport the A6, but it'll certainly get it closer, and I'm sure considering how much more comfortable and luxurious it maintains the F10 to being, might get the dynamics respect it deserves.

I have not driven a F10 with the passive M-Sport suspension, so I cannot comment on it, but my guess is that the ride will be stiffer. The Audi sport suspension is passive and the ride is much stiffer than the F10 regular suspension. Personally, I would not buy mid size luxury sport sedan with a hard suspension, the adjustable suspension make a lot more sense to me. Its not just the suspesnion that makes the A6 feel sportier, the A6 is also more agile, drives much smaller than the F10. The Audi 3.0T engine is a gem, takes off like a rocket and an endless power band on the highway. I am sad to say the N55 really have to take a back seat to the Audi 3.0T engine.

[K-A]

Originally Posted by The X Men

I have not driven a F10 with the passive M-Sport suspension, so I cannot comment on it, but my guess is that the ride will be stiffer. The Audi sport suspension is passive and the ride is much stiffer than the F10 regular suspension. Personally, I would not buy mid size luxury sport sedan with a hard suspension, the adjustable suspension make a lot more sense to me. Its not just the suspesnion that makes the A6 feel sportier, the A6 is also more agile, drives much smaller than the F10. The Audi 3.0T engine is a gem, takes off like a rocket and an endless power band on the highway. I am sad to say the N55 really have to take a back seat to the Audi 3.0T engine.

The amazing thing about the passive suspension is how smooth it is though! I gotta say it was shocking to me to find it was indeed passive after I got the car, as my E-Class was less smooth AND less sporty. I've never been a fan of Active Suspensions (electronic suspensions) as I feel a good passive suspension can be just as good if not better, and more reliable (taking into account I even had an S-Class before with the much revered ABC Suspension.... which was in fact amazing no doubt).

The 2012 M Sport 535i I drove was very noticeably softer than the passive suspension in my car, but I gotta say I can't say that it absorbed bumps night and day or anything like that since I feel the passive suspension really swallows bumps pretty well, all things considered.

Yeah, the 3.0 S/C from Audi is a beast, no doubt it's a stronger motor than the N55. I still prefer the N55 myself as that sound, and style of delivery is so intoxicating to me. When I drove an A7 I thought immediately "Wow, this is a better powerplant than the 535i's, it feels lighter and pushes harder". But then when driving the N55, I just thought "Wow, I need this motor". There's a soul to the BMW I6 whereas the Audi's V6 is a very "clinical" motor to me, perhaps the sound (which is pretty lousy) does that. Of course a lot of that is personal.

[JNoSol]

I like the 3.0 S/C as well. Lots of torque on tap, no spool up. On the N55, we have to admit how amazing it is to have such little lag. The downfall of the N55 is the sound, combined with the ultra quiet F10 body, it doesn't feel sporty.

BMW walks a fine line of power and fuel efficiency. When I had my 535i, I get about 27mpg avg with 70% hwy - normal driving. On long road trips cruising at 80mph, it can hit 32-34mpg. That to me, blows me away that a 2TON car with 300hp can achieve.

I had a 2008 G35x before my first BMW E90. The best mpg it can get was 21mpg avg. This is why I love turbos, non-guilt pleasure.

I do miss the G35 and 350z exhaust note. I really like the Audi 3.0 exhaust note as well. BMW (non-M) needs to look into that, exhaust notes matter.

[The X Men]

Originally Posted by JNoSol

I like the 3.0 S/C as well. Lots of torque on tap, no spool up. On the N55, we have to admit how amazing it is to have such little lag. The downfall of the N55 is the sound, combined with the ultra quiet F10 body, it doesn't feel sporty.

BMW walks a fine line of power and fuel efficiency. When I had my 535i, I get about 27mpg avg with 70% hwy - normal driving. On long road trips cruising at 80mph, it can hit 32-34mpg. That to me, blows me away that a 2TON car with 300hp can achieve.

I had a 2008 G35x before my first BMW E90. The best mpg it can get was 21mpg avg. This is why I love turbos, non-guilt pleasure.

I do miss the G35 and 350z exhaust note. I really like the Audi 3.0 exhaust note as well. BMW (non-M) needs to look into that, exhaust notes matter.

The N55 does have very little turbo lag, it almost feels like a supercharged engine. I find that both the 535xi and my old 2012 C7 A6 got about the same gas mileage on similar commutes, which to me is amazing for cars that size. Exhaust note wise, they both sound the same, boring

[freeewilly]

Agree, my ex-E60 handles much better than the new F10. I enjoyed driving the e60 everyday, but F10 is just car that takes me from point A to point B very comfortably.

[rmastale]

Coilovers will fix your problem.