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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BMW 5-Series (F10) Forums General 5-Series Sedan and Wagon (F10 / F11) Forum F10 pulling to the right...
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      08-29-2010, 10:59 AM   #89
kenhamm
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I think it is a new feature, automatic lane change
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      08-30-2010, 03:27 AM   #90
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Every road have some tilt to let the water resulted from rain draining. That tilt is the principal cause wich make the car pulling to the right.
If you are going on the other side of the road with tilt to the left, you will notice the care are pulling to the left.
My thinking is this.The steering is very sensitive but there is not something wrong with our cars and a manufacturer like BMW can not make such a big mistake with all our cars.

So, my car is pulling to the right if the road is tilted to the right, is pulling to the left if the road is tilted to the left, and go straight if i go on the middle of the road.
So, this is the solution, go on the middle of the road. Just kidding of course about driving on the center of the road.
I tested this last night when the road is empty of other cars.

So please everybody verify what i said
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      08-30-2010, 05:07 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d-rive View Post
Every road have some tilt to let the water resulted from rain draining. That tilt is the principal cause wich make the car pulling to the right.
If you are going on the other side of the road with tilt to the left, you will notice the care are pulling to the left.
My thinking is this.The steering is very sensitive but there is not something wrong with our cars and a manufacturer like BMW can not make such a big mistake with all our cars.

So, my car is pulling to the right if the road is tilted to the right, is pulling to the left if the road is tilted to the left, and go straight if i go on the middle of the road.
So, this is the solution, go on the middle of the road. Just kidding of course about driving on the center of the road.
I tested this last night when the road is empty of other cars.

So please everybody verify what i said
Exactly... does this pull exist on the flat/crown of the road? My concern, will UK cars pull to the left? Two test demo cars I tried didn't.

Simple test to prove a camber pull is, place a small spirit level in the car (where you know it is correctly positioned for flatness, in relation to the body) and try the car on different cambers. If the car pulls to the right on flat or the opposite camber then you have 'pull', if only on the right incline camber, you have camber drift. The test can identify two different problems.

Also does the steering wheel pull, or is ithe car just drifting with the wheel remaining on dead centre?

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      08-30-2010, 05:32 AM   #92
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I've been driving my F10 for the past 6 days (driven on the left side) and there is no pull to date. It is queer that it does not affect all cars if it is a design flaw.
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      08-30-2010, 06:13 AM   #93
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agreed, if anything I have a slight pull to the left but I see no visible tire wear (do those with hard pulling to the right notice uneven wear?) and I think a lot of it has to do with road tilt.
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      08-30-2010, 06:41 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by delvek View Post
agreed, if anything I have a slight pull to the left but I see no visible tire wear (do those with hard pulling to the right notice uneven wear?) and I think a lot of it has to do with road tilt.
If it is a genuine pull, due to some geometry issue, which pull typically is, then rapid and scuffing wear is usually evident.

I personally can't see this problem simply being a software issue, if it is 'pull' as we traditionally know it.

I'm not yet reading anything that suggests it is more than camber sensitivity. Poor for a new model BMW, yes, but could be several factors making it worse, roads, tyre size and the geometry tolerance stack.

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      08-30-2010, 07:01 AM   #95
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My new 550i is fine.
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      08-30-2010, 07:34 AM   #96
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I am by no means an expert and maybe this is stating some obvious facts, but from some reading and talking to a civil engineering friend whose expertise is roads and bridges, I have the following to share:

1. Road crowning percentages vary by municipality, state, country. 2% can be a norm, but so could 3 or 4%. And of course, bends/turns are a different matter.
2. When observing the pull behavior, consider which lane you are in and whether there is a middle median. A 4 lane highway with a center median will see the right lane crown to the right, the left lane to the left. A 6 lane highway with no center median could see the left lane with an effective right leaning grade of 5-6% from the right shoulder.
3. Climate will in part dictate crowning grade. Hot and dry climates will have less of a grade given low rainfall and evaporation.
4. Highways and roads depending on the storm sewer availability will determine grade on a given surface.

What I took away from the chat was us that when we compare experiences on an issue that might be compounded by crowning conditions that are all over the map, we are bound to discover people having big, small and no issues.

Again, I don't know if this is all a summary of obvious knowledge/information but it should certainly be taken into account when evaluating shared experiences. And, I am in no way dismissing that there is a known pulling issue.

For what it's worth, I drove 3 different 5 series cars on long test drives and did not notice this issue. On my current Audi, it does not pull except mildly on 2 highways that I frequent.

Last edited by Soon ExAudi Guy; 08-30-2010 at 07:39 AM.
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      08-30-2010, 09:54 AM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jc031662 View Post
I experience the issue no matter what conditions are present. For example, I can be in the furthermost left lane of 6 lanes on a freeway which has a slight grade down to the left and still pull to the right. If I let go of the steering wheel, I'll be over to the furthermost right lane in a matter of seconds... No matter how you look at it, this is NOT normal - it is a defect.
Ah, if the car will pull right on a left inclined camber, then there is a definite pull issue, it is not just drifting with the camber.

I'd be looking at the geometry, starting with the rear of the car, ensuring the thrust line is bang in the middle, reading zero.

Problem with this kind of thread, we do have to ensure all have the same problem, so easy for those with camber sensitivity and camber drift to be saying their car pulls to the right, when in fact it would drift left on the opposite camber.

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      08-30-2010, 06:20 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jc031662 View Post
I experience the issue no matter what conditions are present. For example, I can be in the furthermost left lane of 6 lanes on a freeway which has a slight grade down to the left and still pull to the right. If I left go of the steering wheel, I'll be over to the furthermost right lane in a matter of seconds... No matter how you look at it, this is NOT normal - it is a defect.
+1
it isn't a camber issue in my case either. The road can slant left and still pull right, albeit more gradually.
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      08-30-2010, 08:21 PM   #99
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Good to go..

Just got my 2011 F10 550 and it does not pull to the right or left. Im here in NYC and I have really been observant on any kind of pull or anything in the driving dynamics and I honestly have not felt anything. I let my brothers drive it as well and they love the way it handles. We all let go of the wheel in a straight away at 30, 50, and 75, Mph and there was absolutely no movement from the wheel or the vehicle. Maybe mine was fabricated after there was a correction to this issue or maybe it will manifest itself at a later time but as of now I have zero issues with pulling right.......
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      08-31-2010, 10:31 AM   #100
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Here's a bit of an update on my situation:

As I stated in a previous post, I decided to go ahead with the lemon law procedures. BMW received my notification and called me immediately. The person I spoke with said she has discussed the situation with an engineer and there is a software fix for it. She gave me a specific date that I have to bring my car in and she is notifying the service manager of my dealership. She mentioned that the dealership will have some tweaks they have to make to my car before they can update the software. I didn't ask what specifically had to be corrected first.

My car will be serviced in 2 weeks. I don't know if that is when the software fix will be released or if that is just specific to my situation. I'm assuming they are just buying some time, but it sounded like a fix is indeed out there. Based on the lemon law here in FL, if they can't fix it on this final attempt, then I have the right to get a refund or a replacement car (after the arbitration process). Ideally, this situation will finally be resolved for me 2 weeks from now. We'll see how things go...
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      08-31-2010, 01:31 PM   #101
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Fix

I took delivery of my 550i (Dark Graphite Metallic/Black Nappa/ZAV/ZDH/ ZSP/ZP2/2TB/Convenience) in Northern California in early August (production date 6/1/10) and noticed pulling to right as others have detailed.

BMW service checked alignment, swapped the front tires from left to right and rotated struts, removed both front struts and compressed the spring to rotate the lower section of the strut assembly by 10mm and finally swapped a complete set of wheels from another car per the instructions of the regional technical engineer, all to no avail. Confirmed that car drifted on roads without a crown. A PUMA case was then started.

New software for the EPS module is available, was installed and has fixed the problem. Good luck to others with this solution.
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      08-31-2010, 03:13 PM   #102
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Good luck to all the guys experiencing this problem. This is a superbly crafted vehicle that will suffer due to this pervasive annoying problem. When and if you all finally get it fixed enjoy the car. It is truly a wonderful drive...
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      08-31-2010, 09:23 PM   #103
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Collectively, our efforts will force them to remain aggressive in their efforts to solve this problem. I will sleep better knowing you guys are rattling their cage. I will do the same should my 550 have this problem once i take delivery. Strong work.
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      08-31-2010, 09:48 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRW94 View Post
New software for the EPS module is available, was installed and has fixed the problem. Good luck to others with this solution.
Does it mean that they installed new software in your F10 and there is no longer a pull?
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      09-01-2010, 01:03 AM   #105
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Does it mean that they installed new software in your F10 and there is no longer a pull?
Correct
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      09-01-2010, 03:46 AM   #106
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A code for this action/operation, a software number or something?
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      09-01-2010, 04:18 AM   #107
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Correct
Thanks, is there a document from your agent showing the rectification done eg http://f10.5post.com/forums/showpost...3&postcount=35
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      09-01-2010, 05:41 AM   #108
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I really wonder how a software revision can set this right... will be interesting to hear how it does, and why the original software allows for a pull. As an engineer, I can't get my head into the way a mechanical set of parts and fixed steering wheel position allows for pulling. I'm assuming the software will be tweaked against steering position (angle) sensor(s) and the wheel speed differentials of a drift. And then correcting the 'collected' data with steering inputs. All a bit tight on tolerance, especially if tyre wear creeps into the equation as well.

Hope it is much more simple than I'm perceiving, or we may revisit this in the future.

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      09-01-2010, 06:05 AM   #109
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Great. Now our beloved F10 has Stealth Bomber B2 technology. Just as the B2 can't fly without constant computer manipulation of control surfaces, our F10 can't drive straight without constant software intervention of steering..........
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      09-01-2010, 12:24 PM   #110
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Service invoice attached. Hope it's helpful. I've driven the car for 2 days and it's fine, though too early to claim an unqualified success.
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