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      09-26-2012, 07:42 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by grimlock View Post
Just because there is a video of a german guy telling you how 'special' "M" is etc. etc. .. it's called marketing.
You seriously think people buy M5s because of a video? You sound like a hater!
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      09-26-2012, 11:43 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by grimlock View Post
Just because there is a video of a german guy telling you how 'special' "M" is etc. etc. .. it's called marketing.
Actually, no. You're really off the mark here. I ordered a fully-loaded '12 550xi back in January, and took delivery in March. Shortly after taking delivery I started modding the car. I ultimately ended up with Dinan Stage 4 (replacing the stock intercoolers), Dinan exhaust, suspension, and some other miscellaneous bits. 525hp or so (I think - never was quite sure).

I figured with all of the upgrades I had a worthy M5 contender. The car was a beast. Insane acceleration, good handling, confident cornering. Replacing the wheels with lightweight HRE's and adding better rubber helped tons with drivability and stability at high speed.

Then, while on a biz trip in Europe, I made the expensive mistake of driving the F10 M5. Holy shit. I wasn't expecting there to be such a dramatic difference between the two cars. After all, I had ARS, DDC, and all the bells/whistles you could shove on the xDrive 550.

It's more than just marketing. It's an M car. And I'm not looking back. I should've kept my E92 M3 a bit longer and not ordered the 550, but in the end, I'm happy - and that's what counts.

I think a lot of the comments on here are driven by jealousy. My oil pump is fine. My car handles great. I don't have "M" problems. Never have, to be honest in any M vehicle I've owned/leased. I can't say that for some other brands. Maybe my luck will change and I will become jaded, but for now I love my purchase and can't wait to get behind the wheel every time I can.

As for the OP and his new business - if his customer is happy with the end result, that's what matters. I disagree with the approach and personally would not be content but in the end it doesn't matter. It would just be nice to voice a dissenting opinion and not be called a hater, etc.
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      09-26-2012, 11:54 PM   #69
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Thats a classy way of disapproving. Point is made without bashing at a very respectable level.

Cheers!
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      09-27-2012, 01:04 AM   #70
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      09-27-2012, 05:29 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by Rus/US View Post
Most countries that have high taxes also have high average annual incomes. Correct me if I'm wrong?
That's generally true.

However the CIA places Norway with an average income per capita of USD 46.300,- and the US at USD 43.800,- (adjusted for GDP - Gross Domestic Product and PPP - Purchasing Power Parity).

So, as you can see the Purchasing Power isn't triple of the US. The problem is that countries with high taxes on cars doesn't have a triple income level. Food, housing etc. are quite similar to neighbouring countries, but the cars are twice or thrice the price as of neighbouring countries...

Average salaries (raw numbers, not adjusted for PPP) might be "just" 10% more than the neighbouring country. Food, clothing etc. are roughly the same amount more expensive. But an M5 costs USD 150.000,- in Sweden and USD 320.000,- in Norway...

The higher salary in Norway doesn't really cover that difference...
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      09-27-2012, 07:30 AM   #72
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Originally Posted by wdimagineer View Post
Actually, no. You're really off the mark here. I ordered a fully-loaded '12 550xi back in January, and took delivery in March. Shortly after taking delivery I started modding the car. I ultimately ended up with Dinan Stage 4 (replacing the stock intercoolers), Dinan exhaust, suspension, and some other miscellaneous bits. 525hp or so (I think - never was quite sure).

I figured with all of the upgrades I had a worthy M5 contender. The car was a beast. Insane acceleration, good handling, confident cornering. Replacing the wheels with lightweight HRE's and adding better rubber helped tons with drivability and stability at high speed.

Then, while on a biz trip in Europe, I made the expensive mistake of driving the F10 M5. Holy shit. I wasn't expecting there to be such a dramatic difference between the two cars. After all, I had ARS, DDC, and all the bells/whistles you could shove on the xDrive 550.

It's more than just marketing. It's an M car. And I'm not looking back. I should've kept my E92 M3 a bit longer and not ordered the 550, but in the end, I'm happy - and that's what counts.

I think a lot of the comments on here are driven by jealousy. My oil pump is fine. My car handles great. I don't have "M" problems. Never have, to be honest in any M vehicle I've owned/leased. I can't say that for some other brands. Maybe my luck will change and I will become jaded, but for now I love my purchase and can't wait to get behind the wheel every time I can.

As for the OP and his new business - if his customer is happy with the end result, that's what matters. I disagree with the approach and personally would not be content but in the end it doesn't matter. It would just be nice to voice a dissenting opinion and not be called a hater, etc.
Then could you tell me what the difference was? If your modded 550ix dinan was such a beast.. why is the M5 better?

You want people to be jealous of you M5, that is why you came here. You want to be admired for something you purchased .. but if you cannot even tell us why your M5 is so great.. perhaps admiration cannot be bought?

Well, technically, you ARE in a F10->M5 conversion thread, and you ARE telling us how one should not do it .. then definitions don't matter.
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      09-27-2012, 08:04 AM   #73
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My opinion is basically that everyone should be allowed his/her personal taste and that basically both a regular F10 and a M5 F10 is just that, a F10 made by BMW. Thats why I also don't buy into the fake thing 100%.

It's not like the car in this thread isn't made by BMW at all (like a fake Rolex watch). It probably has 90% of the same parts as a M5 (engine, transmission etc. are different) and there are just a few cosmetic modifications on this car (all bought OEM from BMW). Yes, it appears to be a M5 (but so does a M-sport 5 series with big wheels as well to the general public).

When that is said. I believe there is quite a big difference in performance and lap times between a 550i (tuned or std) and a M5. The DCT transmission is one area, the exhaust manifold and sound of the M5 but also other little details that all add up to the feel of a very different car. I definitely believe that a M5 (even though it's based on a "humble" F10 5 series) truly stands out from a regular F10 when you drive it.

I would definitely take a M5 over a regular F10 (incl. the M550d or a tuned 550i)
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      09-27-2012, 08:24 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
My opinion is basically that everyone should be allowed his/her personal taste and that basically both a regular F10 and a M5 F10 is just that, a F10 made by BMW. Thats why I also don't buy into the fake thing 100%.

It's not like the car in this thread isn't made by BMW at all (like a fake Rolex watch). It probably has 90% of the same parts as a M5 (engine, transmission etc. are different) and there are just a few cosmetic modifications on this car (all bought OEM from BMW). Yes, it appears to be a M5 (but so does a M-sport 5 series with big wheels as well to the general public).

When that is said. I believe there is quite a big difference in performance and lap times between a 550i (tuned or std) and a M5. The DCT transmission is one area, the exhaust manifold and sound of the M5 but also other little details that all add up to the feel of a very different car. I definitely believe that a M5 (even though it's based on a "humble" F10 5 series) truly stands out from a regular F10 when you drive it.

I would definitely take a M5 over a regular F10 (incl. the M550d or a tuned 550i)
Totally.
If this were the initial complaint against conversions, there would be no retort.
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      09-27-2012, 09:04 AM   #75
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      09-27-2012, 11:06 AM   #76
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      09-27-2012, 05:32 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grimlock View Post
Then could you tell me what the difference was? If your modded 550ix dinan was such a beast.. why is the M5 better?

You want people to be jealous of you M5, that is why you came here. You want to be admired for something you purchased .. but if you cannot even tell us why your M5 is so great.. perhaps admiration cannot be bought?

Well, technically, you ARE in a F10->M5 conversion thread, and you ARE telling us how one should not do it .. then definitions don't matter.
You really don't know when to give up, do you? The M5 has stronger acceleration, better (stock) sound, more supportive seating, stronger components, tighter steering, amazing roadholding, etc. To me it is the difference between a heavy family saloon and a true, nimble sports car. The driving feel is that much different. It does not feel like a 4800lb car.

I'm actually not trying to make anybody jealous. I'm very concerned that you somehow got that impression. After all, I really don't post about my car all that much. I don't have thread after thread detailing my builds with pictures, props from sponsors, etc. In fact I posted a grand total of 5 pictures of my M5.

I'm just an enthusiast who enjoys talking to and seeing pictures of other enthusiast's cars. I have tremendous respect for those who modify their vehicles. I think much of what I see here is very tasteful and executed well.

What I do not respect is a car being turned into something it is not. THAT is the point you should be making. I'm not here to make anybody jealous. But clearly the OP's customer is... there's no other reason to do it. He wants people to think that he's loaded and could afford to drive the M5 in a country where it is prohibitively expensive. I hope that doesn't backfire on him. Though if it did, they'd probably just give the car back when they realize their mistake.
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      09-27-2012, 07:42 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by wdimagineer View Post
You really don't know when to give up, do you? The M5 has stronger acceleration, better (stock) sound, more supportive seating, stronger components, tighter steering, amazing roadholding, etc. To me it is the difference between a heavy family saloon and a true, nimble sports car. The driving feel is that much different. It does not feel like a 4800lb car.

I'm actually not trying to make anybody jealous. I'm very concerned that you somehow got that impression. After all, I really don't post about my car all that much. I don't have thread after thread detailing my builds with pictures, props from sponsors, etc. In fact I posted a grand total of 5 pictures of my M5.

I'm just an enthusiast who enjoys talking to and seeing pictures of other enthusiast's cars. I have tremendous respect for those who modify their vehicles. I think much of what I see here is very tasteful and executed well.

What I do not respect is a car being turned into something it is not. THAT is the point you should be making. I'm not here to make anybody jealous. But clearly the OP's customer is... there's no other reason to do it. He wants people to think that he's loaded and could afford to drive the M5 in a country where it is prohibitively expensive. I hope that doesn't backfire on him. Though if it did, they'd probably just give the car back when they realize their mistake.
So you want people to think you are loaded because you drive an M5, and can't stand when other people who aren't loaded (not actually true, but whatever) 'pretend' to?
Perhaps you should examine this dynamic, either accept the fact that there will always be 'pretend' M5s, or find something else you can ego-attach your spending to, where you won't be equally unable to control yourself from telling people not to imitate your real deal.
Get an Veyron.. fewer imitators. And no 'regular' models..
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      09-28-2012, 10:21 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grimlock View Post
So you want people to think you are loaded because you drive an M5, and can't stand when other people who aren't loaded (not actually true, but whatever) 'pretend' to?
Perhaps you should examine this dynamic, either accept the fact that there will always be 'pretend' M5s, or find something else you can ego-attach your spending to, where you won't be equally unable to control yourself from telling people not to imitate your real deal.
Get an Veyron.. fewer imitators. And no 'regular' models..
You're on a roll. Off the mark, again.

I drive an M5 because I wanted an M5. It's not a status symbol to me. It's a car. I knew what features I wanted and found them in the M5. If I really wanted my car to be a status symbol or a demonstration of my "wealth" I could've purchased something else that is far flashier, louder, or ostentatious.

I accept that there will always be imitators. But I don't have to agree with it and am free to voice my opinion on the matter whenever I choose. If that means being flamed or labeled a hater I will just have to accept that. I have better things to do with my time than lower myself to that level.

Knowing that you're posting from Asia, and more specifically China - notorious for copyright infringement, a flagrant disregard for intellectual property, and flooding markets with cheap, often unsafe imitation goods - leads me to believe that you will never understand nor agree with my point of view. It's only a matter of time before replica M5 body kits start being stamped and sold on eBay from this part of the world.

With that, I'm unsubscribing.
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      09-28-2012, 02:31 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdimagineer View Post
You're on a roll. Off the mark, again.

I drive an M5 because I wanted an M5. It's not a status symbol to me. It's a car. I knew what features I wanted and found them in the M5. If I really wanted my car to be a status symbol or a demonstration of my "wealth" I could've purchased something else that is far flashier, louder, or ostentatious.

I accept that there will always be imitators. But I don't have to agree with it and am free to voice my opinion on the matter whenever I choose. If that means being flamed or labeled a hater I will just have to accept that. I have better things to do with my time than lower myself to that level.

Knowing that you're posting from Asia, and more specifically China - notorious for copyright infringement, a flagrant disregard for intellectual property, and flooding markets with cheap, often unsafe imitation goods - leads me to believe that you will never understand nor agree with my point of view. It's only a matter of time before replica M5 body kits start being stamped and sold on eBay from this part of the world.

With that, I'm unsubscribing.
I suspect that some of your comments earlier in the thread, intended or not, comes across the way that grimlock has interpreted them.

The replica M5 body parts are allready on sale, and marketed by US companies advertising on this forum. So, I would be a little less patronizing towards other countries (even though generally speaking you are correct regarding imitations)...

Replica M5 Front and Rear bumpers
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      09-28-2012, 03:07 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdimagineer View Post
You're on a roll. Off the mark, again.

I drive an M5 because I wanted an M5. It's not a status symbol to me. It's a car. I knew what features I wanted and found them in the M5. If I really wanted my car to be a status symbol or a demonstration of my "wealth" I could've purchased something else that is far flashier, louder, or ostentatious.

I accept that there will always be imitators. But I don't have to agree with it and am free to voice my opinion on the matter whenever I choose. If that means being flamed or labeled a hater I will just have to accept that. I have better things to do with my time than lower myself to that level.

Knowing that you're posting from Asia, and more specifically China - notorious for copyright infringement, a flagrant disregard for intellectual property, and flooding markets with cheap, often unsafe imitation goods - leads me to believe that you will never understand nor agree with my point of view. It's only a matter of time before replica M5 body kits start being stamped and sold on eBay from this part of the world.

With that, I'm unsubscribing.
You're a great sport for putting up with this.
I'll give it one more shot:
Your issue is with imitators/copiers .. which may result from your line of work?
Well. you know the reason why people buy fakes is because they can't afford the real thing, but want the (real) thing.. They were never your customers to start with. Think of it as growing the future pie, they will be your customers in the future when they have money.
Perhaps if you calculate it, you may not even be suffering a direct loss at present, because those sales were never yours.. and the guys who can afford it will buy the real thing if there is a difference in quality.
Don't know if this addresses the original motivation of your post.
Good to argue with you and thank you for your business.
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      09-28-2012, 08:01 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
I suspect that some of your comments earlier in the thread, intended or not, comes across the way that grimlock has interpreted them.

The replica M5 body parts are allready on sale, and marketed by US companies advertising on this forum. So, I would be a little less patronizing towards other countries (even though generally speaking you are correct regarding imitations)...

Replica M5 Front and Rear bumpers
They may be marketed by US companies but are more than likely sourced from this area of the world. They're more likely to be fined/sued/etc. if they were creating these products in the US.

97% perfect fitment. Ha. That makes me laugh.
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      09-28-2012, 08:02 PM   #83
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Quote:
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You're a great sport for putting up with this.
I'll give it one more shot:
Your issue is with imitators/copiers .. which may result from your line of work?
Well. you know the reason why people buy fakes is because they can't afford the real thing, but want the (real) thing.. They were never your customers to start with. Think of it as growing the future pie, they will be your customers in the future when they have money.
Perhaps if you calculate it, you may not even be suffering a direct loss at present, because those sales were never yours.. and the guys who can afford it will buy the real thing if there is a difference in quality.
Don't know if this addresses the original motivation of your post.
Good to argue with you and thank you for your business.
Sure - but they're already BMW customers. They've purchased cars. I hope they can one day afford the real thing. Trust me, it's worth every penny. But I understand that sometimes things get in the way.

Leave the fake stuff off. Keep it real. You're already driving a BMW - doesn't that say enough?
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      09-28-2012, 08:21 PM   #84
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You have to fake it before you make it

Let's get back to the point guys we have a happy BMW owner regardless of the conversion or not.

Keep up the good work Linh!
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      09-28-2012, 09:04 PM   #85
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Lets leave this thread alone and leave the arguing for the "vwvortex forums & and hondatech". We are all bimmer owners here and atleast respect that.

P.S. all this talk about the M5 is making me think...hmmmm
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      01-18-2013, 03:37 PM   #86
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Now, even BMW is into this "fake" trend of modifications...

The M-Performance exhaust finishers for the 535i/535d, quote from BMW's webpage:



Quote:
BMW M Performance exhaust pipe finishers in chrome for BMW 535d and 535i
A clear statement: High-gloss chrome-plated exhaust pipe finishers give the rear of your BMW 5 Series a distinctive eight-cylinder appearance.

exhaust pipe finishers in chrome made of polished, chrome-plated stainless steel high life expectancy and resistance to corrosion for six-cylinder models
for the BMW 535d and BMW 535i
http://www.bmw.com/com/en/owners/acc...ies_sedan.html

Even BMW is OK with these kinds of modifications. Even advertising them as "giving your car that distinct eight-cylinder appearance". If BMW is ok with this kind of styling, why should we disapprove?

Last edited by Boss330; 01-18-2013 at 03:44 PM.
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      01-18-2013, 10:27 PM   #87
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Two thumbs up for such a nice car Linh! nice work!! ..... and for the entertaining read.
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      01-18-2013, 11:56 PM   #88
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I appreciate all of the effort that went into creating a great final product. WoW
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