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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 F10 Technical Topics Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Software Modifications downpipe question
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      02-18-2015, 06:04 AM   #1
mp411
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downpipe question

can someone educate me on downpipes and their functions. why there are 3.5" and 4", why some come with resonators and will there be a more aggressive engine note? Any info and favorite dp's are appreciated.

thanks
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      02-18-2015, 11:07 AM   #2
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+1. I would like to understand this better as well...
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      02-18-2015, 01:10 PM   #3
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Exhaust downpipes live directly on the back of your turbo or turbos. Usually factory downpipe(s) are optimized for stock boost levels and most importantly emissions. Aftermarket units primary purpose is to remove exhaust gases as quickly as possible therefore they usually are larger diameter, less bends, and usually remove some or all emissions equipment. This allows you to raise boost levels more safely over stock without the risk of damage to the turbo.

To answer your 3.5 vs 4" question you will mostly see an improvement in higher horsepower applications that most likely involve larger turbos. Don't stress out too much about half an inch either.. especially and a stage 2 car you'll never really see a difference. If larger turbos and other supporting mods are in the future then it's probably worth going with the larger of the two.

Just keep in mind your state inspections when it comes to choosing catless vs catted since removing your emissions equipment will cause the car not to pass inspections usually. Also most stage 2 cars with aftermarket cats run very close performance-wise to a non catted vehicle. With a catless setup you will definitely hear more turbo noise/spool out the exhaust and typically get a more of a raw smell fuel too. I'll admit though the N55 and the N63 factory downpipes look pretty efficient from factory and I think in order to see significant gains over stock, catless would make more sense.

Also last but not least be sure to pair downpipe changes with some sort of engine management as you will need tuning to compensate. Check out Burger Tuning as they support most platforms.

I'm no expert on the subject but hopefully that gives you a decent idea of their purpose.
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      02-18-2015, 01:21 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e46beater View Post
Exhaust downpipes live directly on the back of your turbo or turbos. Usually factory downpipe(s) are optimized for stock boost levels and most importantly emissions. Aftermarket units primary purpose is to remove exhaust gases as quickly as possible therefore they usually are larger diameter, less bends, and usually remove some or all emissions equipment. This allows you to raise boost levels more safely over stock without the risk of damage to the turbo.

To answer your 3.5 vs 4" question you will mostly see an improvement in higher horsepower applications that most likely involve larger turbos. Don't stress out too much about half an inch either.. especially and a stage 2 car you'll never really see a difference. If larger turbos and other supporting mods are in the future then it's probably worth going with the larger of the two.

Just keep in mind your state inspections when it comes to choosing catless vs catted since removing your emissions equipment will cause the car not to pass inspections usually. Also most stage 2 cars with aftermarket cats run very close performance-wise to a non catted vehicle. With a catless setup you will definitely hear more turbo noise/spool out the exhaust and typically get a more of a raw smell fuel too. I'll admit though the N55 and the N63 factory downpipes look pretty efficient from factory and I think in order to see significant gains over stock, catless would make more sense.

Also last but not least be sure to pair downpipe changes with some sort of engine management as you will need tuning to compensate. Check out Burger Tuning as they support most platforms.

I'm no expert on the subject but hopefully that gives you a decent idea of their purpose.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp411 View Post
can someone educate me on downpipes and their functions. why there are 3.5" and 4", why some come with resonators and will there be a more aggressive engine note? Any info and favorite dp's are appreciated.

thanks
e46beater explains it well


Favorite DP for your car is the Evolution Racewerks catless
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      02-18-2015, 09:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e46beater View Post
Exhaust downpipes live directly on the back of your turbo or turbos. Usually factory downpipe(s) are optimized for stock boost levels and most importantly emissions. Aftermarket units primary purpose is to remove exhaust gases as quickly as possible therefore they usually are larger diameter, less bends, and usually remove some or all emissions equipment. This allows you to raise boost levels more safely over stock without the risk of damage to the turbo.

To answer your 3.5 vs 4" question you will mostly see an improvement in higher horsepower applications that most likely involve larger turbos. Don't stress out too much about half an inch either.. especially and a stage 2 car you'll never really see a difference. If larger turbos and other supporting mods are in the future then it's probably worth going with the larger of the two.

Just keep in mind your state inspections when it comes to choosing catless vs catted since removing your emissions equipment will cause the car not to pass inspections usually. Also most stage 2 cars with aftermarket cats run very close performance-wise to a non catted vehicle. With a catless setup you will definitely hear more turbo noise/spool out the exhaust and typically get a more of a raw smell fuel too. I'll admit though the N55 and the N63 factory downpipes look pretty efficient from factory and I think in order to see significant gains over stock, catless would make more sense.

Also last but not least be sure to pair downpipe changes with some sort of engine management as you will need tuning to compensate. Check out Burger Tuning as they support most platforms.

I'm no expert on the subject but hopefully that gives you a decent idea of their purpose.
Appreciate the clarification! Why I love these forums!
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      02-18-2015, 11:11 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e46beater View Post
Exhaust downpipes live directly on the back of your turbo or turbos. Usually factory downpipe(s) are optimized for stock boost levels and most importantly emissions. Aftermarket units primary purpose is to remove exhaust gases as quickly as possible therefore they usually are larger diameter, less bends, and usually remove some or all emissions equipment. This allows you to raise boost levels more safely over stock without the risk of damage to the turbo.

To answer your 3.5 vs 4" question you will mostly see an improvement in higher horsepower applications that most likely involve larger turbos. Don't stress out too much about half an inch either.. especially and a stage 2 car you'll never really see a difference. If larger turbos and other supporting mods are in the future then it's probably worth going with the larger of the two.

Just keep in mind your state inspections when it comes to choosing catless vs catted since removing your emissions equipment will cause the car not to pass inspections usually. Also most stage 2 cars with aftermarket cats run very close performance-wise to a non catted vehicle. With a catless setup you will definitely hear more turbo noise/spool out the exhaust and typically get a more of a raw smell fuel too. I'll admit though the N55 and the N63 factory downpipes look pretty efficient from factory and I think in order to see significant gains over stock, catless would make more sense.

Also last but not least be sure to pair downpipe changes with some sort of engine management as you will need tuning to compensate. Check out Burger Tuning as they support most platforms.

I'm no expert on the subject but hopefully that gives you a decent idea of their purpose.
My biggest question is if you do the catless, is there a mod out yet that fools the secondary O2 sensors to make them think there is cats so you don't get a false reading? i know other cars have some piggy back units you put on the sensors.
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      02-19-2015, 11:52 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dadysev View Post
My biggest question is if you do the catless, is there a mod out yet that fools the secondary O2 sensors to make them think there is cats so you don't get a false reading? i know other cars have some piggy back units you put on the sensors.
Yes but they are discontinued some down pipe manufacturers make bungs that allow for the readings not to trigger the code. But honestly it comes on every 50 miles. What you can do is get the Bluetooth odb2 reader and reset it using your phone every 50 miles.
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      02-23-2015, 01:18 PM   #8
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Does evolution race werks make a do for f10 m5?
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      03-07-2015, 01:32 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jplohg View Post
Does evolution race werks make a do for f10 m5?
No
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      03-07-2015, 01:36 PM   #10
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OP: I have ER competition catless DP on my car and although it costs more than the others, I'm very happy with my purchase. Im not sure of the difference between 3.5in and 4in but you know what they say, every inch (or half) counts lol. Check my build thread if need be . What really sold me on the ER DP was the robust design and flex section.
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      03-07-2015, 05:55 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
No
My M has this System install : http://www.insideperformance.de/5er-...ownpipes_1293/
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      03-07-2015, 09:32 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Alpinapower View Post
Lucky you. Im not familiar of any US brand that offer M5 DP
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      03-11-2015, 03:01 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Lucky you. Im not familiar of any US brand that offer M5 DP
I know what you mean. A Friend has the System from eurocharged.com i think they have the downpipes catless on stock and the Price was ca. 1500$ (dealerprice)
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      03-11-2015, 08:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badblack550xi View Post
Yes but they are discontinued some down pipe manufacturers make bungs that allow for the readings not to trigger the code. But honestly it comes on every 50 miles. What you can do is get the Bluetooth odb2 reader and reset it using your phone every 50 miles.
+1

I have OBDLINK Lx (Bluetooth) friend has MX (Wifi)
The bluetooth works on Android, Wifi on iPhone
Obdlink also has a free app but we also use dash command and torque pro
able to read, clear codes, auto-clear , see temps, etc
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      03-12-2015, 09:40 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBNYC View Post
+1

I have OBDLINK Lx (Bluetooth) friend has MX (Wifi)
The bluetooth works on Android, Wifi on iPhone
Obdlink also has a free app but we also use dash command and torque pro
able to read, clear codes, auto-clear , see temps, etc
+1 for what ROBNYC said and what badblack550xi said about the Bluetooth OBD II scanner. One of the BEST investments I have made just to get a more complete picture of what your car is really doing. Oh, and clearing fault lights is an added benefit.
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      03-12-2015, 10:52 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TShoot View Post
+1 for what ROBNYC said and what badblack550xi said about the Bluetooth OBD II scanner. One of the BEST investments I have made just to get a more complete picture of what your car is really doing. Oh, and clearing fault lights is an added benefit.
yet BMW charges $180 to read codes...
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      03-13-2015, 02:19 AM   #17
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Even if I have the BMS tune, I will still get a CEL if I do a catless dp??
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      03-28-2015, 01:32 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phil7027 View Post
Even if I have the BMS tune, I will still get a CEL if I do a catless dp??

Yes as the BMS doesn't have the ability to turn off codes.

Here's what I plan on getting based on other members luck with them. I've used anti-foulers before on other cars so I'm hoping they work out ok!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/290756683675...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
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      03-29-2015, 05:57 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e46beater View Post
Yes as the BMS doesn't have the ability to turn off codes.

Here's what I plan on getting based on other members luck with them. I've used anti-foulers before on other cars so I'm hoping they work out ok!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/290756683675...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

JB4 DOES clear codes, it just comes back once in a while.

+1 on doing it remotely via DashCommander/bluetooth.
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      03-29-2015, 09:50 AM   #20
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Apologies, I keep thinking we are talking about an N63.
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      03-29-2015, 12:46 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e46beater View Post
Yes as the BMS doesn't have the ability to turn off codes.

Here's what I plan on getting based on other members luck with them. I've used anti-foulers before on other cars so I'm hoping they work out ok!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/290756683675...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Just 1 of these and you're good ?
Someone mentioned a spacer also
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      03-29-2015, 02:27 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBNYC View Post
Just 1 of these and you're good ?
Someone mentioned a spacer also
they don't always work
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