2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
 

2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BIMMERPOST Universal Forums General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos 2020-202x Toyota Supra
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-21-2019, 03:41 PM   #661
hellrotm
Banned
4143
Rep
6,926
Posts

Drives: F80
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ...Location...Location

iTrader: (0)

So I guess we have the explanation for how C&D achieved 3.8sec 0-60 with the new 335 hp Supra.

They dynoed it at 339 whp and 427 wtq. Using a generic drivetrain loss of 15% nets 390 hp and 491 tq at the crank.


Appreciate 1
supra932474.00
      05-21-2019, 03:44 PM   #662
Red Bread
Major General
United_States
4462
Rep
9,160
Posts

Drives: Smog machines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

I think 10% is the new norm for power loss for autos and DSG. But that's still 370/470, which certainly better explains the impressive performance.
Appreciate 0
      05-21-2019, 04:46 PM   #663
GoneIn4Secs
Banned
1286
Rep
1,675
Posts

Drives: BSM F87 LCI (DCT)
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: GTA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellrotm View Post
So I guess we have the explanation for how C&D achieved 3.8sec 0-60 with the new 335 hp Supra.

They dynoed it at 339 whp and 427 wtq. Using a generic drivetrain loss of 15% nets 390 hp and 491 tq at the crank.


They also had m2c dynos at the beginning that were like 450whp and 600 wtorque
Appreciate 0
      05-21-2019, 04:48 PM   #664
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Here is the link the the C&D article.

Side note, does that mean the Z4 is pushing around 380hp to the wheel?

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...no-horsepower/

Appreciate 0
      05-21-2019, 05:05 PM   #665
hellrotm
Banned
4143
Rep
6,926
Posts

Drives: F80
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ...Location...Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneIn4Secs View Post
They also had m2c dynos at the beginning that were like 450whp and 600 wtorque
Car&Driver? Dynojet?

EAS M2comp Dynojet numbers were 397 whp and 437 whp.

(Edit: I am sure you are referring to Gpower dyno 439hp/607nm? Different type of dyno. By the way 600NM is 442 ft-lb.)

Last edited by hellrotm; 05-21-2019 at 05:20 PM..
Appreciate 0
      05-21-2019, 05:09 PM   #666
hellrotm
Banned
4143
Rep
6,926
Posts

Drives: F80
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ...Location...Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
I think 10% is the new norm for power loss for autos and DSG. But that's still 370/470, which certainly better explains the impressive performance.
It surely isn't lacking in torque. It is putting down M4(non-zcp) and M2comp Dynojet torque numbers.


Appreciate 1
Red Bread4462.00
      05-21-2019, 06:46 PM   #667
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Appreciate 0
      05-21-2019, 09:13 PM   #668
N54Yankee
Lieutenant Colonel
N54Yankee's Avatar
United_States
2706
Rep
1,916
Posts

Drives: N54 135|Cobb|M3 control arms
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

That video has it at 4.3 0-60 and that one dyno posted earlier has it producing much more then advertised power, more so then I recall others doing and the graph gets real hinky like an EKG above 3k rpm, very strange for a stock engine.
Maybe a ringer?
__________________
__________________
"The Constitution was never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms.” Samuel Adams

Last edited by N54Yankee; 05-22-2019 at 06:05 AM..
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 08:21 AM   #669
OkieSnuffBox
Major
1803
Rep
1,011
Posts

Drives: '13 135i
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: OKC, OK

iTrader: (0)

The torque is likely high because they didn't dyno it in a 1:1 gear.
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 09:17 AM   #670
Red Bread
Major General
United_States
4462
Rep
9,160
Posts

Drives: Smog machines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox View Post
The torque is likely high because they didn't dyno it in a 1:1 gear.
They mentioned that it was corrected for that and they did test in 1:1 and it had similar numbers but wouldn't redline because of the speed governor, so they used the corrected other ratio.
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 10:32 AM   #671
Dog Face Pony Soldier
2006 TIME Person Of The Year
Dog Face Pony Soldier's Avatar
United_States
9720
Rep
6,445
Posts

Drives: M Sport 335i
Join Date: May 2013
Location: North Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 335i  [9.74]
Still waiting for all the people always complaining that cars aren't "tossable" or that they're too heavy to chime in with some kudos here. This thing might lack a MT but it definitely appears to be very nimble.

Still smh from all the people acting like any addition of BMW into a Toyota is anything but a good thing. Perhaps the Camry is more their cup of tea?
__________________
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 10:49 AM   #672
Red Bread
Major General
United_States
4462
Rep
9,160
Posts

Drives: Smog machines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Still waiting for all the people always complaining that cars aren't "tossable" or that they're too heavy to chime in with some kudos here. This thing might lack a MT but it definitely appears to be very nimble.

Still smh from all the people acting like any addition of BMW into a Toyota is anything but a good thing. Perhaps the Camry is more their cup of tea?
Meh, its still a pig. It's just a powerful pig. If it had advertised hp and just weighed 400 pounds less it would be a lot more impressive. It's close in size to a Cayman and weighs about 12% more.
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 01:21 PM   #673
The HACK
Midlife Crises Racing Silent but Deadly Class
The HACK's Avatar
1817
Rep
5,337
Posts

Drives: 2006 MZ4C, 2021 Tesla Model 3
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Welcome to Jamaica have a nice day

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Meh, its still a pig. It's just a powerful pig. If it had advertised hp and just weighed 400 pounds less it would be a lot more impressive. It's close in size to a Cayman and weighs about 12% more.
How about 200 lbs less and same power? Would anyone buy that?

330hp, 3,200 lbs soaking wet, same MSRP. Same stiff chassis built in the same factory*.

Believe you me. People don't care about the weight. As long as it wears a Supra badge you'll get enough people to want to buy it for the name alone.

*11 years ago
__________________
Sitting on a beat-up office chair in front of a 5 year old computer in a basement floor, sipping on stale coffee watching a bunch of meaningless numbers scrolling aimlessly on a dimly lit 19” monitor.
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 03:55 PM   #674
tennisfreak
Second Lieutenant
201
Rep
296
Posts

Drives: M240i
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: DFW

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Meh, its still a pig. It's just a powerful pig. If it had advertised hp and just weighed 400 pounds less it would be a lot more impressive. It's close in size to a Cayman and weighs about 12% more.
A bare bones Cayman S PDK is 3054lbs and equipped like a Supra easily over 3100lbs so its not like the Cayman is a featherweight.

Add in the Supra has a far far far better engine and is $20k cheaper than a stripper S model I'd say the Supra is doing pretty well for itself and the weight is easily forgivable.
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 04:02 PM   #675
Red Bread
Major General
United_States
4462
Rep
9,160
Posts

Drives: Smog machines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tennisfreak View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Meh, its still a pig. It's just a powerful pig. If it had advertised hp and just weighed 400 pounds less it would be a lot more impressive. It's close in size to a Cayman and weighs about 12% more.
A bare bones Cayman S PDK is 3054lbs and equipped like a Supra easily over 3100lbs so its not like the Cayman is a featherweight.

Add in the Supra has a far far far better engine and is $20k cheaper than a stripper S model I'd say the Supra is doing pretty well for itself and the weight is easily forgivable.
That's still 10%. I know most folks don't care. If they did the piggy GTR would have never sold. But it's fast, so it sold. For some folks that's all that matters.
Appreciate 0
      05-22-2019, 04:15 PM   #676
SoCal_NSX
Major
SoCal_NSX's Avatar
2363
Rep
1,356
Posts

Drives: 981CS/428/is250/JLU Rubicon
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Center of the Universe

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tennisfreak View Post
A bare bones Cayman S PDK is 3054lbs and equipped like a Supra easily over 3100lbs so its not like the Cayman is a featherweight.

Add in the Supra has a far far far better engine and is $20k cheaper than a stripper S model I'd say the Supra is doing pretty well for itself and the weight is easily forgivable.
The 981 or the 718?

Both engines are seemingly bulletproof these days....and the both Cayman versions have a rep as being one of the best pure sports cars on the road.

I'd much rather have a base Cayman 981 or 718 over the hideous looking Supra

Looks are subjective, so some may like it, but most think it's fugly af

Looks nothing like what they used for the prototype....it's like one of those
Before and after pics of a meth user


But this is just my opinion


Before meth


After meth addiction

Last edited by SoCal_NSX; 05-22-2019 at 04:27 PM..
Appreciate 2
gatorfast4969.00
clee1982796.00
      05-23-2019, 11:17 AM   #677
tennisfreak
Second Lieutenant
201
Rep
296
Posts

Drives: M240i
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: DFW

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX View Post
The 981 or the 718?

Both engines are seemingly bulletproof these days....and the both Cayman versions have a rep as being one of the best pure sports cars on the road.

I'd much rather have a base Cayman 981 or 718 over the hideous looking Supra

Looks are subjective, so some may like it, but most think it's fugly af

But this is just my opinion
I was quoting brand new Cayman weights and prices.

Any regardless of "bulletproof" the Cayman engine is a turbo 4 banger vs an inline 6 for the Supra.
The inline 6 is a smoother better performing and sounding engine in every way possible with much more room for growth.

As for looks yeah the Cayman is a good looking car but is also generic in regards to the same basic porsche look they've had for decades.

The Supra is an acquired taste but its far from generic or common.

Personally I'd choose the better engine for $25k+ less all day long.
Heck I could buy a brand new Supra and then go buy a used 981, for the same price as a new Cayman S, and have my cake and eat it too!!!
Appreciate 0
      05-23-2019, 03:06 PM   #678
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

I will admit that it isn't as sexy as the concept, and some areas could use improvement. (Mirrors, wheels, needs a wing & see through hood from the FT1 would be nice). However, at the same time it is a $50k car. Either way, imo, its no where near the hideous level of the R35 GTR.
Appreciate 0
      05-23-2019, 03:23 PM   #679
Red Bread
Major General
United_States
4462
Rep
9,160
Posts

Drives: Smog machines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by supra93 View Post
I will admit that it isn't as sexy as the concept, and some areas could use improvement. (Mirrors, wheels, needs a wing & see through hood from the FT1 would be nice). However, at the same time it is a $50k car. Either way, imo, its no where near the hideous level of the R35 GTR.
And it's a good bit lighter than that ugly thing too. Never understood the appeal of the R35. Love the R33 and R34, next year will be the first one to allow R33 imports.
Appreciate 1
supra932474.00
      05-23-2019, 04:27 PM   #680
supra93
Colonel
2474
Rep
2,334
Posts

Drives: Z4, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
And it's a good bit lighter than that ugly thing too. Never understood the appeal of the R35. Love the R33 and R34, next year will be the first one to allow R33 imports.
GTR fanboys will say function over form.

The R35 owners that I have talked with admit its no beauty queen, but they brought it for the performance.
Appreciate 1
Red Bread4462.00
      05-23-2019, 11:53 PM   #681
psuibmw
Brigadier General
psuibmw's Avatar
United_States
3465
Rep
3,071
Posts

Drives: G06/G20/F30/F15/F10/E90
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Baltimore, MD

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2018 BMW 320xi  [10.00]
2023 BMW M340  [9.75]
2022 BMW  [10.00]
In the Bimmers enthusiasts forum, the most talked about vehicle is the Toyota Supra
Appreciate 1
wdb4673.00
      05-24-2019, 04:09 AM   #682
yco
i'm just saying
yco's Avatar
5721
Rep
2,634
Posts

Drives: E71 X6M '10 (sold)
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Istanbul & Kyiv

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by psuibmw View Post
In the Bimmers enthusiasts forum, the most talked about vehicle is the Toyota Supra
better than new X1 and its more than half BMW in the end..
Appreciate 1
alex23642846.50
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:03 AM.




5post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST