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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 F10 Technical Topics Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Software Modifications Permanent throttle body / adaptive transmission reset
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      08-18-2020, 11:51 PM   #1
dzz
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Permanent throttle body / adaptive transmission reset

As many have noticed after performing throttle body / adaptive transmission reset, a few days later the car becomes sluggish (again) and it doesn't drive as good (aggressive) as when the throttle body / adaptive transmission reset was performed. I have MHD stage 2+ and XHP stage 4 and the same thing is still happening.

Is there a way to permanently reset and not allow the throttle body and the transmission to adapt to driving style. Is this something that could be potentially coded with E-sys?
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      08-19-2020, 06:57 AM   #2
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Not sure about tranny but what about this for throttle. Seems popular and well liked by bmw owners:

https://www.sprintboostersales.com/S...17ABFAA9A4D421
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      08-19-2020, 07:05 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dzz View Post
As many have noticed after performing throttle body / adaptive transmission reset, a few days later the car becomes sluggish (again) and it doesn't drive as good (aggressive) as when the throttle body / adaptive transmission reset was performed. I have MHD stage 2+ and XHP stage 4 and the same thing is still happening.

Is there a way to permanently reset and not allow the throttle body and the transmission to adapt to driving style. Is this something that could be potentially coded with E-sys?
Mine was too horrible stock, but since MHD and xHP I don't notice this being a thing.

I'm curious - it might not be your thing permanently but what happens if you set linear throttle mode in MHD? This is my choice all the time because I like it this way. I'm wondering if the "linear" function disables a bunch of the adaptive stuff altogether, making behaviour more consistent and less variable due to adaptations.

Overly sensitive controls and a throttle which is the same at 50% as 100% doesn't appeal to me so I was excited about MHD's linear option. It was also a feature that swayed my MHD vs BM3 purchase decision. I just want the thing to act as a bowden cable like they used to have. My past 92 Porsche's mechanical throttle actually had a cam/lever affair to linearize the power output vs pedal movement since a butterfly valve is by nature non-linear. Neat stuff. My 98 528's Dinan throttle body may have also.
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      08-19-2020, 09:06 AM   #4
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Didn’t XHP say not to use linear with their tune?
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      08-19-2020, 09:51 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylverlee View Post
Didn’t XHP say not to use linear with their tune?
xHP says not to use devices or algorithms which modify the throttle curve, you're right, but they've told me not to worry about linear. More below:

Here they really mean not to use modification which increase the throttle curve (e.g. make it act faster). They read the pedal position and set shift pressures and other things based on that. If you put something in which has engine output significantly above what's expected the shift pressure would be too low and you'd get slip, wear, and bad stuff.

With linear throttle, the engine is usually making less torque than the normal factory curves and, if anything, shift pressure is higher than necessary.

In an interaction with them I asked about this and was told pretty much the above - they're way more concerned about people who do things to make the pedal even more sensitive than normal and not the other way.

To be absolutely technically correct - yes, even linear is not what they expect. I've been running it for about 1.5 years that way though. More than that - I've found that with my stage 1 tune with linear throttle has about the same power output at lower throttle angles as no tune and stock throttle mapping. Really - it probably plays with xHP just fine since you don't tell xHP you have a tune when you load it.

My "extra zoom" from stage 1 just comes as more power deeper in the pedal, where stock tune and stock pedal curve results in no further increase in power.
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      08-19-2020, 10:58 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surly73 View Post
Mine was too horrible stock, but since MHD and xHP I don't notice this being a thing.
I do notice a difference even with MHD stage 2+ and XHP flashed to stage 4. The only time when this is not an issue is when I put transmission in sport mode and select driving experience switch to Sport + mode. This puts XHP in track mode and it keeps the car in lower gear/high RPM (compared to Sport or Comfort mode) all the time to produce highest torque and a given speed. It is pretty aggressive and according to XHP it is meant for a track.

I always drive my car in Sport mode and after throttle body reset it feels just right, very responsive and not too aggressive, hence the question if there is a way to reset throttle body adaptation to factory default values permanently.
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      08-19-2020, 01:48 PM   #7
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Food for thought:

https://www.xhpflashtool.com/blog/adaptions/
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      08-19-2020, 01:51 PM   #8
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Great explanation and makes perfect sense. Thanks for sharing.
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      08-19-2020, 02:06 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dzz View Post
I do notice a difference even with MHD stage 2+ and XHP flashed to stage 4. The only time when this is not an issue is when I put transmission in sport mode and select driving experience switch to Sport + mode. This puts XHP in track mode and it keeps the car in lower gear/high RPM (compared to Sport or Comfort mode) all the time to produce highest torque and a given speed. It is pretty aggressive and according to XHP it is meant for a track.

I always drive my car in Sport mode and after throttle body reset it feels just right, very responsive and not too aggressive, hence the question if there is a way to reset throttle body adaptation to factory default values permanently.
I don't have a DEC switch, though I think I'll be more or less forced to retrofit one, so I don't have any driving modes. I believe xHP does it's thing based solely on D/S/M for my vehicle.
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      08-19-2020, 02:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burro_blasta View Post
This isn't what the OP is trying to reset, but that article is great info that I try to raise awareness of whenever people post about resetting TCU adaptations on fluid changes and similar.

The xHP article doesn't really go into all of the other adaptations, nor confirm exactly what is being reset by the "hold the throttle" reset.

When I use MHD to reset all adaptations for other purposes, none of those changes creates the feeling of a fresh "hold the throttle" reset, so I've always been curious exactly what it's doing. I haven't yet read anything definitive.

Last edited by Surly73; 08-19-2020 at 02:14 PM..
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      08-19-2020, 02:12 PM   #11
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That's cause they are only addressing the transmission shift point adaptations based on transmission wear and idiosyncrasies of each individual transmission as no transmission is exactly the same as the other.

The hold the throttle is a different adaptation and they don't mess with those ones in their transmission tunes.
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      08-19-2020, 02:16 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrowBMW View Post
That's cause they are only addressing the transmission shift point adaptations based on transmission wear and idiosyncrasies of each individual transmission as no transmission is exactly the same as the other.

The hold the throttle is a different adaptation and they don't mess with those ones in their transmission tunes.
^^^ If that's for me - I know. I'm saying it's not the same thing, but the xHP article is extremely valuable information which should be circulated. DO NOT reset transmission adaptations when you change the fluid, etc...
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      08-19-2020, 02:17 PM   #13
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If I want to change how my transmission feels and shifts I just change my shoes. I have thicker soles when I want my clutch to engage faster 6MT FTW

YES it is a great article and makes a ton of sense.
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      08-19-2020, 08:54 PM   #14
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Thanks for clarifying - I didn't realize there is more than one type of adaptation reset. I had lumped them all together when reading posts like this
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      08-19-2020, 10:27 PM   #15
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With throttle body reset, the car feels more "aggressive" and the transmission shifts better in a sense that the shifts are more crispier and there is no delay between pressing the gas pedal and getting a response from the engine and the transmission. XHP article refers to transmission lifetime wear adaptations which is different from what I was trying to do.
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      08-19-2020, 10:50 PM   #16
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Whenever I read about people raving about how much better the car feels after a throttle body reset, I always wonder how much of it is placebo.

If I had to guess, it's probably 75% placebo.
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      08-20-2020, 02:59 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unspec View Post
Whenever I read about people raving about how much better the car feels after a throttle body reset, I always wonder how much of it is placebo.

If I had to guess, it's probably 75% placebo.
When I used to do them - absolutely not placebo. It's not subtle - at all. I find that, for me, it affected transmission behaviour a lot. Better shifts and the car just moves.

On the other hand, there is no way it's a throttle body reset. The N55 is Valvetronic - there is no throttle body. (Well, technically, there is a throttle body that comes into play as a safety net if Valvetronic is inoperative. When the engine is operating normally that butterfly valve is wide open.)

I have yet to see anywhere that DEFINITIVELY tells us what is being reset by that action. I'd love links to real, reliable info. As I mentioned in an earlier post - I've used MHD to reset a laundry list of adaptations and none of them include whatever this is.

All that said, since MHD w/ linear throttle and xHP I never need to do this anymore. I should go out and see if I even notice a difference now. I think it's possible that it isn't actually "throttle body" adaptation, but it might be "throttle mapping" adaptation - tweaking the algorithm/map/table which lies between the physical pedal and the torque demand parameter input to the DME. I find it entertaining that it's supposed to adapt the car to be better matched to individual drivers but everyone hates it
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      08-21-2020, 12:58 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surly73 View Post
[

When I used to do them - absolutely not placebo. It's not subtle - at all. I find that, for me, it affected transmission behaviour a lot. Better shifts and the car just moves.
I have the same experience
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      08-22-2020, 12:21 AM   #19
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I got a response from XHP and they say that the procedure we call throttle body reset actually resets driver's key profile.
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      08-29-2020, 11:02 PM   #20
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It looks like I have to do throttle body adaptation or as XHP says driver's key profile reset once per week so that my car "feels" normal and not lethargic. Anyone else with same or similar experience?
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      08-30-2020, 07:35 PM   #21
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What exactly is feeling lethargic? Shifts? Acceleration? Throttle response? I've never reset the throttle body even once and the car is as zippy as ever.
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      08-31-2020, 06:24 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unspec View Post
What exactly is feeling lethargic? Shifts? Acceleration? Throttle response? I've never reset the throttle body even once and the car is as zippy as ever.
You're tuned. After I put MHD on I've never even been tempted to do this reset which, pre-tune, used to cause dramatic improvement.
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