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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BIMMERPOST Universal Forums Professional Motorsport Racing Discussion (IMSA, DTM, Formula 1, Grand-AM, Le Mans, IRL, WRC, etc..) F1 2021: British GP - Silverstone (July 18)
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      07-18-2021, 06:19 PM   #331
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Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Ah you've reappeared now that Sir 7ewis finally won a race. Is it his raw talent that won him this one? Because all I've seen him and Mercedes do is complain how RB is cheating with some kind of superior technology or how the tires are bad and so forth. However In this case, it's playing dirty that won him the race. Otherwise, care to explain such a precipitous drop in Sir 7Ewis's skills in one year?
It's been the technology all along my friend. Hamilton had its benefits for the better part of 10 years, now RB does.
I've actually been traveling for the past 4 weeks around the country for work. I've popped in a few times in other parts of the thread and actually congratulated Max for one of his wins. Try better next time.

On to the rest of your post. The FIA changed the rules to favor cars with shorter wheelbases and higher rakes. This is irrefutable. This isn't about skill in this case. From the beginning, Max has had a faster car. Sir Lewis managed to win a few races in a slower car. Just as he did in 2009 against the Brawn and in the EBD era against Red Bull. If you seriously think Sir Lewis has lost his skill, you clearly don't know anything about F1. If you seriously think that even after the run of wins by RB and Max that Sir Lewis was out of contention for the title, you know even less than I think you know about F1.

The thing about relatively new fans (less than 10 years of closely following the sport) is that they don't have the knowledge of turns and round-abouts the championship battles take. Go back to 2017 and 2018 with the illegal Ferrari. Not-then Sir Lewis won against a faster Ferrari. Just as he did in the 2008 championship. Further, Sir Lewis is only about 20 points from being a 10x WDC. Think about this for a second.

And as far as your point about dirty driving, go back and review the times Max has done the EXACT SAME THING. I'm glad he is ok. He and his fans should never say anything about driving standards. Mr. I-will-headbutt-the-next-person-that-brings-up-my driving has a history of being a bully. He even did so multiple times this race and several times this season against Sir Lewis. This time Sir Lewis didn't back out.

Max should learn from this if he wants to become WDC. We shall see.
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      07-18-2021, 06:23 PM   #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
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Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Ah you've reappeared now that Sir 7ewis finally won a race. Is it his raw talent that won him this one? Because all I've seen him and Mercedes do is complain how RB is cheating with some kind of superior technology or how the tires are bad and so forth. However In this case, it's playing dirty that won him the race. Otherwise, care to explain such a precipitous drop in Sir 7Ewis's skills in one year?
It's been the technology all along my friend. Hamilton had its benefits for the better part of 10 years, now RB does.
I've actually been traveling for the past 4 weeks around the country for work. I've popped in a few times in other parts of the thread and actually congratulated Max for one of his wins. Try better next time.

On to the rest of your post. The FIA changed the rules to favor cars with shorter wheelbases and higher rakes. This is irrefutable. This isn't about skill in this case. From the beginning, Max has had a faster car. Sir Lewis managed to win a few races in a slower car. Just as he did in 2009 against the Brawn and in the EBD era against Red Bull. If you seriously think Sir Lewis has lost his skill, you clearly don't know anything about F1. If you seriously think that even after the run of wins by RB and Max that Sir Lewis was out of contention for the title, you know even less than I think you know about F1.

The thing about relatively new fans (less than 10 years of closely following the sport) is that they don't have the knowledge of turns and round-abouts the championship battles take. Go back to 2017 and 2018 with the illegal Ferrari. Not-then Sir Lewis won against a faster Ferrari. Just as he did in the 2008 championship. Further, Sir Lewis is only about 20 points from being a 10x WDC. Think about this for a second.

And as far as your point about dirty driving, go back and review the times Max has done the EXACT SAME THING. I'm glad he is ok. He and his fans should never say anything about driving standards. Mr. I-will-headbutt-the-next-person-that-brings-up-my driving has a history of being a bully. He even did so multiple times this race and several times this season against Sir Lewis. This time Sir Lewis didn't back out.

Max should learn from this if he wants to become WDC. We shall see.
Sorry you're completely sidestepping the obvious point that even your boy and his team, just like every other team makes when they're losing…the other car must have a technological advantage. The drivers themselves are saying the other team has a better car. If that's not prima facie evidence of what is the primary driver of championships in F1, I don't know what is.
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      07-18-2021, 06:48 PM   #333
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I wonder, where is all this complaining about fairness when precious max pushes other cars out of bounds, overtakes outside track limits, or causes a collision ....
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      07-18-2021, 06:48 PM   #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Sorry you're completely sidestepping the obvious point that even your boy and his team, just like every other team makes when they're losing…the other car must have a technological advantage. The drivers themselves are saying the other team has a better car. If that's not prima facie evidence of what is the primary driver of championships in F1, I don't know what is.
You've apparently missed the posts here from the RB fans talking about the technical superiority of the Mercedes and denigrating Sir Lewis's accomplishments.

I will just ask you to cast your mind back to the number of pole positions Max had prior to this year: 4 in a top 3 car for all but part of one year of his 6 years in F1. This is a damning stat for anyone that knows F1. Contrast this with Sir Lewis who has 4 in 2009 when he was driving the objectively determined 6th fastest car on the grid.

Max is a great driver. He simply isn't as good as his press, team, and fans think he is. And the results speak of this.
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      07-18-2021, 07:03 PM   #335
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Holy shit, is that a legit social media post from Max?? Not sure my ticker can take much more of this on Sunday mornings.

That one had me worried. Thank goodness for the run off and tire barrier at Copse. And the fact the car stayed upright. Seems that could have easily been an ALO in Australia tumbling type of crash.

Incredible recovery drive from HAM. Once again, the racing gods are in HAM's corner. A 180 mph impact and one nub on his front wing needed some tape. Both his talent and luck are unlimited.

Amazing effort from LEC. Did everything possible, geek squad protocols on his very Italian F1 car had me and my Ferrari loving son laughing. Charles is a soldier.

In light of recent precedent (Austria) a penalty was never in doubt to me. Just waited for the details as Crofty and the Sky Sports team were going full homer...

The stewards have set the terms, these aren't racing incidents.

The inside car must yield. Must yield and give room everywhere from apex to track out when the car to the outside is equal or a fraction of a front wing ahead. Let alone when the inside car's front left is level with outside car's rear right, and the inside car is off the racing line + car widths wide of apex as Lewis was.

I'm not saying HAM clipped him on purpose, but at minimum he carried too much speed in. The inside line through Copse was demonstrated by none other than HAM when he passed LEC for the race win.
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      07-18-2021, 07:09 PM   #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
"BS" !!!
Here is "who was wrong" voted the latest online 'Poll !

And "HERE" is "THE" answer :
[/B]
•MAX => 1%
•HAM => 93 %
•Race incident => 5%
•Both => 1%
Doesn't matter. Right or wrong, there was more room to the left.

A WDC leader has more to loose and should have taken the safer path.
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      07-18-2021, 07:14 PM   #337
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If Max has to miss a race because of injury, Hammy should be suspended for a race.
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      07-18-2021, 07:19 PM   #338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdott View Post
Doesn't matter. Right or wrong, there was more room to the left.

A WDC leader has more to loose and should have taken the safer path.
Max had to turn into the corner or go off. Hammy completely missed the apex. This is proven by the fact that Charles decided to not turn in and got run off the track to avoid Hammy. Now that Ham fisted Hammy can’t win, he’s going to run people off the track. The FIA needs to step in before someone gets hurt or killed. It’s not a corner to be running people off of.
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      07-18-2021, 07:23 PM   #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyn-BMW View Post
If Max has to miss a race because of injury, Hammy should be suspended for a race.
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Originally Posted by Cyn-BMW View Post
Max had to turn into the corner or go off. Hammy completely missed the apex. This is proven by the fact that Charles decided to not turn in and got run off the track to avoid Hammy. Now that Ham fisted Hammy can’t win, he’s going to run people off the track. The FIA needs to step in before someone gets hurt or killed. It’s not a corner to be running people off of.
Max, what are you doing in this thread?
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      07-18-2021, 07:32 PM   #340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyn-BMW View Post
Max had to turn into the corner or go off. Hammy completely missed the apex. This is proven by the fact that Charles decided to not turn in and got run off the track to avoid Hammy. Now that Ham fisted Hammy can’t win, he’s going to run people off the track. The FIA needs to step in before someone gets hurt or killed. It’s not a corner to be running people off of.
Don't be a drama queen.

They both have tangled before this season. Max "won" those incidents, Ham "won" this one. On to the next race. Glad Max physically ok.
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      07-18-2021, 07:40 PM   #341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdott View Post
Doesn't matter. Right or wrong, there was more room to the left.

A WDC leader has more to loose and should have taken the safer path.
And suddenly it doesn't matter anymore . WTF !!!
Your question was : "Who was wrong" !

Negative again : Max was leading the race by the length of a car, and Hammy had to take the safer path 'in the very fast Copse turn !
MAX ran at that moment on the perfect race line at Copse . Hammy was only there to complete his 'Torpedo on MAX right rear wheel !

Mate .Do you even watched the race ?
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      07-18-2021, 07:47 PM   #342
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Don't be a drama queen.

They both have tangled before this season. Max "won" those incidents, Ham "won" this one. On to the next race. Glad Max physically ok.
I fail to see how what happened at a previous race, makes any difference here. But, that does bring up a big problem. With different people making these calls at every race, there is no consistency. The stewarts should be the same people at every race.
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      07-18-2021, 07:54 PM   #343
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I fail to see how what happened at a previous race, makes any difference here. But, that does bring up a big problem. With different people making these calls at every race, there is no consistency. The stewarts should be the same people at every race.
Just that they have been racing incidents.


You're right about the stewards.
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      07-18-2021, 07:57 PM   #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yco View Post
being taken out... like he was not trying to slam Lewis to wall.. its called victim syndrome.. and there shouldnt be any celebrations because Max was out of the race? there should ve been a mourning on podium?

from being overly cocky personality from his talks to acts on track to a cat that licks milk from the floor.. Max has talent but thats all still..

and Horner says.. i hope Lewis is happy with himself.. sounds like a mom talking for her daughter that has been dumbed lately..

move on Red Bull..
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      07-18-2021, 07:58 PM   #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyn-BMW View Post
I fail to see how what happened at a previous race, makes any difference here. But, that does bring up a big problem. With different people making these calls at every race, there is no consistency. The stewarts should be the same people at every race.
It's a pattern of behavior with Max bullying other drivers. They, including Sir Lewis, usually back off. They even joke about giving Max extra room. This time Sir Lewis held his line while Max yanked his steering wheel to the right. We all know the result.
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      07-18-2021, 07:58 PM   #346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyn-BMW View Post
Max had to turn into the corner or go off. Hammy completely missed the apex. This is proven by the fact that Charles decided to not turn in and got run off the track to avoid Hammy. Now that Ham fisted Hammy can’t win, he’s going to run people off the track. The FIA needs to step in before someone gets hurt or killed. It’s not a corner to be running people off of.
There was room on the outside and he could have backed off. He had options. He choose to turn in aggressively.

Leading the WDC and faster race pace from the sprint race. He had more to loose.
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      07-18-2021, 08:01 PM   #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
Max, what are you doing in this thread?
.
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      07-18-2021, 08:04 PM   #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Sorry you're completely sidestepping the obvious point that even your boy and his team, just like every other team makes when they're losing…the other car must have a technological advantage. The drivers themselves are saying the other team has a better car. If that's not prima facie evidence of what is the primary driver of championships in F1, I don't know what is.
You've apparently missed the posts here from the RB fans talking about the technical superiority of the Mercedes and denigrating Sir Lewis's accomplishments.

I will just ask you to cast your mind back to the number of pole positions Max had prior to this year: 4 in a top 3 car for all but part of one year of his 6 years in F1. This is a damning stat for anyone that knows F1. Contrast this with Sir Lewis who has 4 in 2009 when he was driving the objectively determined 6th fastest car on the grid.

Max is a great driver. He simply isn't as good as his press, team, and fans think he is. And the results speak of this.
Ever hear the expression the easiest explanation is probably the correct one? You're so embroiled in all the details and stats, you miss the easiest and most logical explanation for what drives winning in F1. You're so far up Hamilton's a** that any counterpoint is instantly moot, not worth any consideration. It's in your signature for goodness sake.

Ask HAAS why McLaren is better…technology.
Ask McLaren why Mercedes is better…technology.
Ask Red Bull why Mercedes is better in 2020…technology.
Ask Mercedes why Red Bull is better in 2021…technology.


It comes straight from the mouths of the drivers themselves. Every single time.

Before Hamilton, there was Schumacher. He was mediocre outside Ferrari. Take Hamilton from Mercedes…will he win? Sure. Will he dominate? No way.

By the way, not everything is Hamilton vs Verstappen, I don't care about any driver that much, but since you take it there, Verstappen has wiped the floor with Hamilton this season, DNF and luck excluded. When they are actually racing this season, Verstappen clearly is better. I don't think it has anything to do with skill of the drivers. Red Bull just has the better car, for now.
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      07-18-2021, 08:11 PM   #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdott View Post
There was room on the outside and he could have backed off. He had options. He choose to turn in aggressively.

Leading the WDC and faster race pace from the sprint race. He had more to loose.
WOW ! That must be really new mate !

If the leader in a race has to back off . Then Hammy had won 'ZERO (0) championships !

OK . Next time , only clean air for Hammy only !
As he is used to run in clean air only...
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      07-18-2021, 08:15 PM   #350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Ever hear the expression the easiest explanation is probably the correct one? You're so embroiled in all the details and stats, you miss the easiest and most logical explanation for what drives winning in F1. You're so far up Hamilton's a** that any counterpoint is instantly moot, not worth any consideration. It's in your signature for goodness sake.

Ask HAAS why McLaren is better…technology.
Ask McLaren why Mercedes is better…technology.
Ask Red Bull why Mercedes is better in 2020…technology.
Ask Mercedes why Red Bull is better in 2021…technology.


It comes straight from the mouths of the drivers themselves. Every single time.

Before Hamilton, there was Schumacher. He was mediocre outside Ferrari. Take Hamilton from Mercedes…will he win? Sure. Will he dominate? No way.

By the way, not everything is Hamilton vs Verstappen, I don't care about any driver that much, but since you take it there, Verstappen has wiped the floor with Hamilton this season, DNF and luck excluded. When they are actually racing this season, Verstappen clearly is better. I don't think it has anything to do with skill of the drivers. Red Bull just has the better car, for now.
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      07-18-2021, 08:19 PM   #351
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Ever hear the expression the easiest explanation is probably the correct one? You're so embroiled in all the details and stats, you miss the easiest and most logical explanation for what drives winning in F1. You're so far up Hamilton's a** that any counterpoint is instantly moot, not worth any consideration. It's in your signature for goodness sake.

Ask HAAS why McLaren is better…technology.
Ask McLaren why Mercedes is better…technology.
Ask Red Bull why Mercedes is better in 2020…technology.
Ask Mercedes why Red Bull is better in 2021…technology.


It comes straight from the mouths of the drivers themselves. Every single time.

Before Hamilton, there was Schumacher. He was mediocre outside Ferrari. Take Hamilton from Mercedes…will he win? Sure. Will he dominate? No way.

By the way, not everything is Hamilton vs Verstappen, I don't care about any driver that much, but since you take it there, Verstappen has wiped the floor with Hamilton this season, DNF and luck excluded. When they are actually racing this season, Verstappen clearly is better. I don't think it has anything to do with skill of the drivers. Red Bull just has the better car, for now.
I can truly tell that you know very little about F1. It isn't technology that makes a team better. It's people and application of technology. They are all mandated to use the same materials and many of the parts, which are listed, MUST be used. It isn't technology but, rather, creativity within the rules structure.

You are saying my data and details blind me? This is F1. It's about nothing but data and details. For you to even make a statement like that tells me sooooooo much. You are like so many who look at the sport in a snapshot and make broad statements when the longitudinal data look says something quite different. You are fighting data with opinion. Well...go for it. And continue to be blind.

How long have you been watching the sport?
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      07-18-2021, 08:21 PM   #352
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Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by e90335e36m3 View Post
Ever hear the expression the easiest explanation is probably the correct one? You're so embroiled in all the details and stats, you miss the easiest and most logical explanation for what drives winning in F1. You're so far up Hamilton's a** that any counterpoint is instantly moot, not worth any consideration. It's in your signature for goodness sake.

Ask HAAS why McLaren is better…technology.
Ask McLaren why Mercedes is better…technology.
Ask Red Bull why Mercedes is better in 2020…technology.
Ask Mercedes why Red Bull is better in 2021…technology.


It comes straight from the mouths of the drivers themselves. Every single time.

Before Hamilton, there was Schumacher. He was mediocre outside Ferrari. Take Hamilton from Mercedes…will he win? Sure. Will he dominate? No way.

By the way, not everything is Hamilton vs Verstappen, I don't care about any driver that much, but since you take it there, Verstappen has wiped the floor with Hamilton this season, DNF and luck excluded. When they are actually racing this season, Verstappen clearly is better. I don't think it has anything to do with skill of the drivers. Red Bull just has the better car, for now.
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Thanks for that. That's exactly what I'm trying to say, but I guess since I don't follow F1 with the type of passion some on here do, I'm not educated enough to deduce a pretty common sense conclusion.

All these teams do is accuse each other of cheating because they lose.
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