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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BIMMERPOST Universal Forums Professional Motorsport Racing Discussion (IMSA, DTM, Formula 1, Grand-AM, Le Mans, IRL, WRC, etc..) Why doesn't F1 use inline six cylinder engines?
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      10-29-2018, 11:57 PM   #1
rainfall
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Why doesn't F1 use inline six cylinder engines?

Lots of people complain that F1 lost the sound of the V8 (well I miss the V10's for that matter). I kind of agree that the V6's don't sound as great and we all know the downsize is due to emissions regulations (right?)

Regardless, I wonder what would happen if F1 implemented the straight six in their engines. In my (biased) opinion, it would sound a lot better than the current V6's, would have a similar displacement and sound amazing. Wouldn't it?
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      10-30-2018, 03:25 AM   #2
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Agreed. You should write them a letter.
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      10-30-2018, 03:26 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainfall View Post
Lots of people complain that F1 lost the sound of the V8 (well I miss the V10's for that matter). I kind of agree that the V6's don't sound as great and we all know the downsize is due to emissions regulations (right?)

Regardless, I wonder what would happen if F1 implemented the straight six in their engines. In my (biased) opinion, it would sound a lot better than the current V6's, would have a similar displacement and sound amazing. Wouldn't it?
Nope, not really.

What we need as an additional 3000rpm. Currently the engines only goes to 10k rpm, or thereabouts.

The old V10s and V8s were around 16k - 18k rpm, and that's what made them so nice.

Apparently, changing the engine noise for the better, is quite high up Liberty Media's list of things to do after 2020. Let's hope they get it right, as every time I hear a sound clip of the old F1 cars I get sad.

Edit to add: packaging a straight 6 engine into an F1 car would almost be impossible, with the current setup they are running. It would mean the car would have to be a lot longer, and that would greatly reduce the nimbleness of the cars.
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      10-30-2018, 03:54 AM   #4
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Same reason that a lot of manufacturers use V6 in passenger cars: length.

If Iím not mistaken, an inline-six would be longer than a V10 (which is essentially five-cylinders long).

And there are plenty of good-sounding V6 engines in the world, not sure why you think the inline-six would make a difference.
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      10-30-2018, 07:32 AM   #5
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Also consider...turbos quiet exhaust quite a bit plus the 1.6 V6 engines are limited to 15,000 rpm, but rarely exceed 12,000 rpm during a race due to the new reliability (three ICE's for a season or grid penalties) and the dreaded fuel flow restrictions. Plus, when the new engine regs were being considered, inline 4 cylinder engines were initially part of the discussion but Adrian Newey pointed out that a change to a V6 would enable teams to still carry the engine as a stressed member, whereas an inline 4 would have required a space frame. The same would apply to an I6. Additionally, it would be hard to imagine Ferrari embracing an I6 engine formula.
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      10-30-2018, 08:26 AM   #6
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Because they don't want to give their packaging engineers an aneurysm?
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      10-30-2018, 05:30 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJBO View Post
Same reason that a lot of manufacturers use V6 in passenger cars: length.

If Iím not mistaken, an inline-six would be longer than a V10 (which is essentially five-cylinders long).

And there are plenty of good-sounding V6 engines in the world, not sure why you think the inline-six would make a difference.
Great response. I haven't noticed a lot of V6 sounds, but I do remember driving the Dodge Challenger V6 I rented a couple of weeks ago in a travel. It didn't sound great. Didn't sound horrible, but nothing like the BMW's I-6 that I have heard.

Maybe the Dodge wasn't the greatest example of a good V6 sound.
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      10-30-2018, 06:43 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainfall View Post
Maybe the Dodge wasn't the greatest example of a good V6 sound.
Listen to a Busso and then say again that a v6 doesnt sound great.

I think that mainly because F1 had V engines for so long they went with V6.
An inline engine results in a completely different layout of the car. With a V engine you can have the inlet in the V, coming from the top of the car and the exhaust manifolds on both sides.
An inline engine has a different layout.
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      10-30-2018, 07:14 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainfall View Post
Maybe the Dodge wasn't the greatest example of a good V6 sound.
Haha

The engine in the Golf R32 MkV is a good N/A V6 sound, Alfa Romeo did some fantastic sounding ones too.

(Terrible videos, but at least there isn't music all over them!)



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      10-30-2018, 07:15 PM   #10
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As long as itís not a BMW turboíd in-line 6. Those sound like poop. Esp. the s55.
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      10-30-2018, 07:30 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJBO View Post
Haha

The engine in the Golf R32 MkV is a good N/A V6 sound,
The Golf R32 doesnt have a V6 but a VR6 which is far more akin to the I6 than to the V6, both in headflow as well as firing order.
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      10-31-2018, 12:39 AM   #12
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I attend races every year. The first season of the hybrid era, you could have a conversation with the person next to you on the main straight with the cars going by at full tilt. The cars each year seem to get louder. In my opinion this year they were very loud and sound quite good actually.
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      10-31-2018, 07:35 PM   #13
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Why not flat (boxer) configurations? Lower CG's for everyone but they might be a bit wider than current power units.

Maybe Porsche will throw their hat in the ring?

Never mind, so might Subaru.
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      10-31-2018, 07:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
The Golf R32 doesnt have a V6 but a VR6 which is far more akin to the I6 than to the V6, both in headflow as well as firing order.
True it is a VR6, which is more compact than an I6.
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      10-31-2018, 08:38 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caffeine Powered View Post
Why not flat (boxer) configurations? Lower CG's for everyone but they might be a bit wider than current power units.

Maybe Porsche will throw their hat in the ring?

Never mind, so might Subaru.
Ferrari also knows how to do flat.
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      11-01-2018, 05:19 AM   #16
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first of all its size.. V is more compact.. V is lighter..
V has more low-end torque (2 crankshafts).. if you compare right now the revs of F1 engines low end torque is quite important.. V has lower center of gravity since the cylinders are not vertical.. their tilted.. these reason may look not that important but for F1 its deadly important..
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      11-02-2018, 04:43 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hellrotm View Post
I attend races every year. The first season of the hybrid era, you could have a conversation with the person next to you on the main straight with the cars going by at full tilt. The cars each year seem to get louder. In my opinion this year they were very loud and sound quite good actually.
They do sound a lot better than before, but still nowhere near the V8 and V10s of yesteryear.
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      11-02-2018, 05:55 AM   #18
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V6's don't sound nice? You've obviously never heard the song of Alfa's Busso V6.

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      11-02-2018, 06:31 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yco View Post
first of all its size.. V is more compact.. V is lighter..
V has more low-end torque (2 crankshafts)..
A V engine with 2 crankshafts?!? What engine might that be to be exact?
And a V6 engine doesn't have more low end torque.
In fact, finding an undersquare V6 is much harder than finding an undersquare i6.

And even the weight is debatable; a v6 has twice as many camshafts (albeit shorter but not twice as short), chains, chainwheels, tensioners etc. If you look at normal car engines, a V6 is usually roughly the same weight as an i6.


Why they use v6 in F1 is really very simple: its in the rulebook. any other engine configuration would mean immediate disqualification.
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      11-03-2018, 12:24 PM   #20
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yeah since english is not my own language its so hard to understand what actually i meant.. woww..
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      11-03-2018, 12:28 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Railgun View Post
That's a non-answer. No shit it's in the rule book.



That has no bearing on whether the FIA would/could/should look at another package.
And the answer whether an i6 may perform better is?
Since when is it the task of the FIA to find the best performing configuration? It isn't.
They just set a bunch of rules to keep it controllable, manageable and accesable. IF they wanted the best configuration they'd set a v12 with unlimited turbo's and displacement....
Why the FIA chose a V6 instead of an i6 or b6... no one knows. Maybe even marketing might be involved.
People here seem to think a V6 might have an edge over an i6 or b6 performance wise (or vice versa). I don't think that has anything to do with it.
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Last edited by GuidoK; 11-03-2018 at 12:34 PM..
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      11-04-2018, 12:07 AM   #22
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Guys guys, isn't it obvious...TWO CRANKSHAFTS...enough said.
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