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2010 2011 BMW 5 Series Forum F10 BMW 5-Series (F10) Forums General 5-Series Sedan and Wagon (F10 / F11) Forum Overheating issue
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      09-14-2020, 09:44 PM   #1
stevem0
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Overheating issue

2011 535 xDrive

These problems have not happened before. I have owned the vehicle for 5 years.

Jumped in it Saturday afternoon, two problems at the same time? AC did not work, and overheated, quickly into limp mode.

Checked coolant level, it was fine. When I removed the reservoir cap, it looked like the water/coolant pump was working. There was water flow thru the reservoir and there was a stream of water near the cap, I thought, the pump must be working. The alarm said engine area very hot. The electric radiator fan runs and kicks on high, air feels cool. (definitely not hot radiator). Running the heat inside on high, the air does not get warm.

Let the car sit for 3-4 hours, drove home and overheat warning and limp mode 100 yards from the house.

Ran thru as much diagnostics as I could tonight. Reservoir cap off, and ignition on, something is pumping coolant. Same issue, idle for 5 min and overheat alarm comes on.

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My first guess is that the thermostat is stuck closed. I just can not believe that the AC and the thermostat both died at exactly the same time. Usually it is blowing cold air before I put it in reverse. I was backing out of the driveway saying, what is wrong with the AC??? Having both of these symptoms at the exact same time, makes me wonder if my problem is even more mysterious.

Deeper into ISTA, I see where the Aux Coolant pump recircs the water to electronics and the coolant reservoir. So this must be the action I see when looking in the top of the reservoir.

With the ISTA, I was able to cycle the coolant pump on/off and heard absolutely No noise. (I wish there was some rpm feedback), So I think the main pump is bad.

Need some logic/thought process check, please let me know what you think:

1. Replace main coolant pump. (Thermostat does not seem necessary. Is it like an extra 5 minute job, or possibly another hour? What about the lower temp thermostat?)

2. Is the AC, interlocked with the coolant pump? If the coolant pump does not come on, will the AC compressor be locked out? I figured I would find out after I replace the coolant pump.

Thank you for Any advice!!!
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      09-14-2020, 10:25 PM   #2
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I've seen multiple over heating problems on 335i, all we're fixed with water pump/thermostat change. Don't be fooled with the stream from the reservoir, as you said it would be nice if there was a rpm sensor to see if the pump is actually working. Also make sure you bleed the coolant system properly as air pockets will give you overheating problems too.
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      09-15-2020, 01:55 AM   #3
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I suspect a bad thermostat. If you have to replace it, go ahead and replace the water pump. It is recommended to replace both at the same time. It’s the same amount of labor since both are in the same spot.
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      09-15-2020, 07:18 AM   #4
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Within a hundred yards of starting there would be no way to know the t-stat is bad, in my opinion, except perhaps for pins shorted to +12 or ground. There's no way temperature would build so quickly.

The pump, on the other hand, could detect 0 revolutions very quickly and pop a warning.

I used INPA on my E90 to test the water pump, fan and all kinds of stuff just for kicks. It is annoying that ISTA doesn't give pump rev feedback. I haven't tried to run INPA on the F10. If it works, it might be a better tool for this purpose. With INPA you could request a target water pump % and read back the resulting RPM if my memory is correct.

ALSO: for the pump you could try activation the bleed function. Turn on ignition, don't start engine, throttle pedal to the floor for 10s, if I remember correctly. You should hear it then, although if you are not accustomed to exactly how it sounds when everything is working properly it might not be a perfect tool.
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      09-15-2020, 10:07 AM   #5
stevem0
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Thanks. With ISTA, there is a section in the DME to activate the water/coolant pump for 20S, I could not see (In reservoir) or hear any difference. I could turn all kinds of other things on and off, fans, relays, etc etc. I could hear them all but not the water pump.

I am ordering Pump & Tstat, plan to change them both, Ugh.

Does anyone know if the AC will be disabled if the water pump failed?
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      09-16-2020, 08:11 AM   #6
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I just replaced my thermostat and water pump this summer. Only as preventative maintenance. Diy cost was $3-400. Kit from fcp euro. Not easy. But not hard. As I have active sway bar and awd. Coming from a e39 m54. Cooling system was Achilles heel for that car. So wasn't sure if it would also be for f10. I'm at 130k. So just peace of mind for me. But best to just do yours if you have high mileage/age. Only thing that doesn't make sense is how quick you said it overheated.
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      09-16-2020, 08:46 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surly73 View Post
Within a hundred yards of starting there would be no way to know the t-stat is bad, in my opinion, except perhaps for pins shorted to +12 or ground. There's no way temperature would build so quickly.

The pump, on the other hand, could detect 0 revolutions very quickly and pop a warning.

I used INPA on my E90 to test the water pump, fan and all kinds of stuff just for kicks. It is annoying that ISTA doesn't give pump rev feedback. I haven't tried to run INPA on the F10. If it works, it might be a better tool for this purpose. With INPA you could request a target water pump % and read back the resulting RPM if my memory is correct.

ALSO: for the pump you could try activation the bleed function. Turn on ignition, don't start engine, throttle pedal to the floor for 10s, if I remember correctly. You should hear it then, although if you are not accustomed to exactly how it sounds when everything is working properly it might not be a perfect tool.
Ignition on, heat on max fan speed low and accelerator to floor for 10 seconds =)
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      09-16-2020, 03:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BurrNinja View Post
Ignition on, heat on max fan speed low and accelerator to floor for 10 seconds =)
Hey burrNijia,

Is that different than toggling the cooling pump on for 20 seconds in the ISTA ECU? Thanks!

Anyone have a guess about the A/C being disabled with cooling pump not working?
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      09-16-2020, 04:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevem0 View Post
Anyone have a guess about the A/C being disabled with cooling pump not working?
This is a total guess, but part of the charm of these cars is that everything is very thoughtfully over-engineered. It wouldn't shock me at all if the computer disables the AC if it thinks the engine is running hot in order to shed load.

Like I said however - that's nothing more than a guess.
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      09-16-2020, 04:40 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevem0 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BurrNinja View Post
Ignition on, heat on max fan speed low and accelerator to floor for 10 seconds =)
Hey burrNijia,

Is that different than toggling the cooling pump on for 20 seconds in the ISTA ECU? Thanks!

Anyone have a guess about the A/C being disabled with cooling pump not working?
Yeah thats just for the waterpump activation for bleeding the entire coolant system.
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      09-17-2020, 09:10 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevem0 View Post
Hey burrNijia,

Is that different than toggling the cooling pump on for 20 seconds in the ISTA ECU? Thanks!

Anyone have a guess about the A/C being disabled with cooling pump not working?
RE: A/C. I would just fix your confirmed problem and then see what's happening with the AC. If the ECU expects that it has NO COOLING, I would not be surprised if systems like AC were shut down.

Or, using ISTA select that fault and calculate a test plan and do whatever it says.
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      09-17-2020, 10:21 PM   #12
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Started the repair tonight, the first of many questions:

1. Any good suggestions how to best separate the tstat housing and the hose from radiator?

2. The bolt that secures the tstat housing, (below the tstat housing). How do you get that bugger back in during install?
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      09-19-2020, 09:34 PM   #13
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everything ive read on the internet with a F10 and a 8020C7 code needed a new AC Compressor
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      09-19-2020, 11:39 PM   #14
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Just did my thermostat and water pump on my 535 RWD. I ended up removing the radiator fan for more room, and didn't need to remove or lower the sway bar. And I found using a bit of butter made the hoses slide right on. I was really impressed with how much easier it made reassembly.
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      09-20-2020, 05:27 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWFLf10 View Post
Just did my thermostat and water pump on my 535 RWD. I ended up removing the radiator fan for more room, and didn't need to remove or lower the sway bar. And I found using a bit of butter made the hoses slide right on. I was really impressed with how much easier it made reassembly.
Not sure how you got the pump out with sway bar installed. My issue making this longer repair than required is pump bracket was broke, I have to wait on it.
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      09-21-2020, 01:13 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevem0 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SWFLf10 View Post
Just did my thermostat and water pump on my 535 RWD. I ended up removing the radiator fan for more room, and didn't need to remove or lower the sway bar. And I found using a bit of butter made the hoses slide right on. I was really impressed with how much easier it made reassembly.
Not sure how you got the pump out with sway bar installed. My issue making this longer repair than required is pump bracket was broke, I have to wait on it.
I ended up removing it from the top. Once the fan was out of the way, it really wasn't too difficult.
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      10-19-2020, 11:20 PM   #17
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This was a two week job, once I had all the parts, (pump and Tstat) Planning on burning up the entire Saturday. Well, the pump off and some BMW Engineer made a whoopsie on his calculation and there was this offset bracket to make sure the water pump would line up with the hoses about 1.5 shift in the bolts. It was just a flat plate with the bolt holes moved. Anyhow, this bracket was cracked, took me a week to get the bracket welded back up.

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      07-13-2023, 05:07 AM   #18
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Check the radiators too; mine was completely blocked with dirt
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Last edited by ScorpionulNegru; 07-13-2023 at 05:10 AM.. Reason: Add a picture
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      07-13-2023, 03:48 PM   #19
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Check the radiators too; mine was completely blocked with dirt
Wow, that's some use! Did you clean off the condenser as well?
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